Silicondust DVR Kickstarter

[Ed]

As to Ed's point about first airings in a different country, I have watched several Syfy shows that originally aired in Canada and are marked as repeats in WMC. I usually set all series to record new episodes only, but these specific series, I have to set to record the new and reruns, which sometimes clogs up my DVR as it records marathons of previous seasons as well. I don't see how the grid-style guide would improve this situation..

Because with a typical grid epg it will at least still show up for you to tell it to record them as repeats even when they're technically not. With SD's picture guide it won't show up in their 'Show/picture/series/set-it-and-forget-it/whatever guide'. Ever. Unless you happen to be in the 'on live' or 'almost live' guides at the same time the show is. So if you wanna make sure you never miss anything you might want to record, at the fault of the SD's 'guide' and not yourself for just not seeing it, you need to monitor your 'on live' and 'almost live' guides 24/7; and juggle/switch between at least 3 different guide interfaces for your DVR instead of just one.

Okay, I understand where you were coming from now, but again, that is not an issue that I would ever run into. In WMC now, I wouldn't scan through 2 weeks of Syfy's schedule in the guide to find one of these affected series. Instead, I go to the option from the Recorded TV section to add a recording, then I search by title. My understanding is that a title search still exists in the HDHR DVR, but again, I haven't seen the software in person yet.

As for the existence of a grid guide, I'm not saying it isn't useful in some situations, but for my usage of a DVR, it is not necessary - as long as I have some way to see what is on now or in the near future. Nick indicated that they are overhauling the current implementation of this live and near-live guide, so I am sitting back and waiting on what that final version will be before I decide if I can use it.

Yeah, and like i told that other dude, if your use case falls in line with this and how it is shaping up, then rock on. But there's obviously enough people all over saying 'this is an issue for me' that it is an issue for the program and SD as a whole. Then add in all the spouses/family members/children/laymen who would have to use this too, but don't frequent these forums to voice their complaints and concerns. The problem is blindingly apparent.

[golfdude]

heres a question that affects very few, but is a future proofing issue

i just got a new tv that supports 4k resolutions, when my media center pc is set to anything higher than a 1080p resolution, windows media center throws a fit b/c the resolution is "too high" for it, and causes glitches and bugs in WMC itself, (it actually has that error message when you boot up WMC in a resolution higher than 1080p) .. so im wondering, will the SD DVR stand alone program be able to handle resolutions higher than 1080p?

[GIJOE4LIFE]

[/quote]

Yeah, and like i told that other dude, if your use case falls in line with this and how it is shaping up, then rock on. But there's obviously enough people all over saying 'this is an issue for me' that it is an issue for the program and SD as a whole. Then add in all the spouses/family members/children/laymen who would have to use this too, but don't frequent these forums to voice their complaints and concerns. The problem is blindingly apparent.[/quote]


What are we talking about a cure for world hunger, or a computer program. I will give you credit you and a few others can really rile people up over a grid style epg. And we are talking about grown people here. I see earlier you said you couldn't be convinced to change your mind who cares if you change your mind about the sinister plot by SD to deny users what is apparently mentally needed grid style guide. We poor users cannot conceive of any other way of finding and recording programs, so there must not be another way. A grid style epg has made us what we are today and we thank you for your unflinching strength since you and a few others have been elected as our representatives.

Before the grid style epg there was what? You are right the problem is blindingly apparent, the grid style epg has made us weak, unable to take the overwhelming stress's of a new style epg. The thought of not having it has destroyed the very fabric of tv culture. I may not have changed your mind but you have definitely changed mine. I am against having a grid style epg it's old fashioned, it apparently weakens us to change. It makes us unable to see an entire program and only concentrate on it.

As for my wife factor she was not born with the knowledge of a grid style epg, she had to learn. If a new guide can do what we both need without a specialized degree I am sure she is more than capable of learning it, if not she shouldn't be watching tv anyway.

[bobitha]

Before the grid style epg there was what? You are right the problem is blindingly apparent, the grid style epg has made us weak, unable to take the overwhelming stress's of a new style epg. The thought of not having it has destroyed the very fabric of tv culture. I may not have changed your mind but you have definitely changed mine. I am against having a grid style epg it's old fashioned, it apparently weakens us to change. It makes us unable to see an entire program and only concentrate on it.

You should go and organize ALL your finances the same way as SD is presenting its ON NOW then...... Presenting large amounts of data in a manner that flows isnt WEAK its called a SPREADSHEET it is uesed the world over for presenting data in a manner that is easy to navigate and find all related information across the sheet..... You cant seem to understand Wheels are best for vehicles to limit friction. A wheel to a car is as a Grid EPG is to a STB/DVR its not rocket science it is just the most efficient means of doing what you want it to do. PERIOD its not even subjective. Before STB's with Grid guides there was the tv guide channel which would scroll through a GRID GUIDE for all shows on..... and before that was the NEWSPAPER guess what it used.... A GRID GUIDE!!!! Amazing how all the weak people as you call them continue to use a grid guide they must be afraid of change.... tell you what go put some triangle tires on your vehicle tell me how that works out for ya mmmk

People are not UP in arms because of the fact it is not a grid but how else are you going to display all the information in a grid epg??? I want to know what is on for the next few hours at a glance..... current SD DVR guides do not do anything in that regard.... when i put shows on for my kids i do so with the intent of not having to come back every 30 minutes to change channel because junk came on... same goes for when i have nothing to watch on the dvr and i want something mildly entertaining i want to not have to channel surf. There is no reason to channel surf its a waste of time and the current guide is set up for those people who just want to see the current shows on and do no future planning to their tv watching.... i want to clean my house for 3 hours and put it on a channel without having to touch the remote how would you do this with your current guide HMMM you are the weak one who cannot see beyond 30 minutes or an hour...dont say that a grid epg makes people weak it is quite opposite those who can actually take in the information and make decisions based off it are not weak at all! TROLL ON BUB!

[GIJOE4LIFE]

Before the grid style epg there was what? You are right the problem is blindingly apparent, the grid style epg has made us weak, unable to take the overwhelming stress's of a new style epg. The thought of not having it has destroyed the very fabric of tv culture. I may not have changed your mind but you have definitely changed mine. I am against having a grid style epg it's old fashioned, it apparently weakens us to change. It makes us unable to see an entire program and only concentrate on it.

You should go and organize ALL your finances the same way as SD is presenting its ON NOW then...... Presenting large amounts of data in a manner that flows isnt WEAK its called a SPREADSHEET it is uesed the world over for presenting data in a manner that is easy to navigate and find all related information across the sheet..... You cant seem to understand Wheels are best for vehicles to limit friction. A wheel to a car is as a Grid EPG is to a STB/DVR its not rocket science it is just the most efficient means of doing what you want it to do. PERIOD its not even subjective. Before STB's with Grid guides there was the tv guide channel which would scroll through a GRID GUIDE for all shows on..... and before that was the NEWSPAPER guess what it used.... A GRID GUIDE!!!! Amazing how all the weak people as you call them continue to use a grid guide they must be afraid of change.... tell you what go put some triangle tires on your vehicle tell me how that works out for ya mmmk

What does my finances have to do with how guide data is displayed in a program? Anyway if the way the data is displayed needs to be tweaked, you make suggestions for improving it. Why demand a grid style epg as if it's the perfect vehicle to display tv data, it is not. A stone wheel on a car is a grid style epg, something better would have air in it. You can't seem to understand air in wheels are better. Period its not even subjective. Going by your logic I would conclude since the grid style epg started with newspaper it would be the better format, so why don't you just ask for a printed grid style epg. And since some use to use hangers as antennas why don't they supply those also. By the way I like how you took the weak people thing and twisted it, very impressive. Taking things and twisting them is that a learned behavior or does it come naturally. Why don't we make the triangle tires be a grid style epg

[ajhieb]

What does my finances have to do with how guide data is displayed in a program? Anyway if the way the data is displayed needs to be tweaked, you make suggestions for improving it. Why demand a grid style epg as if it's the perfect vehicle to display tv data, it is not. A stone wheel on a car is a grid style epg, something better would have air in it. You can't seem to understand air in wheels are better. Period its not even subjective. Going by your logic I would conclude since the grid style epg started with newspaper it would be the better format, so why don't you just ask for a printed grid style epg. And since some use to use hangers as antennas why don't they supply those also. By the way I like how you took the weak people thing and twisted it, very impressive. Taking things and twisting them is that a learned behavior or does it come naturally. Why don't we make the triangle tires be a grid style epg

Yes and no. I'm very much in the "let's not act like the sky is falling" camp, but both sides have merit.

The usefulness of a grid PG guide most definitely is subjective. It will vary greatly depending on your viewing habits. I happen to fall in the camp of people that will miss the familiarity of it, but should be fine without it. That doesn't mean other people don't rely on it much more than I do. I can certainly see situations where people use it more that I do. To be honest I was somewhat skeptical of how prolific those usage cases are, and i suppose I still am to a degree (I suspect a lot of people are worrying a lot more over the outlier cases than than routine operation) but I don't deny that there are cases where using a grid guide would be better nore convenient or maybe even necessary.

That said, even for those spots, I'm still curious to see what SD delivers, since my understanding of things is that the Search and "now showing" methods are not the only things being developed.

[bobitha]

What does my finances have to do with how guide data is displayed in a program? Anyway if the way the data is displayed needs to be tweaked, you make suggestions for improving it. Why demand a grid style epg as if it's the perfect vehicle to display tv data, it is not. A stone wheel on a car is a grid style epg, something better would have air in it. You can't seem to understand air in wheels are better. Period its not even subjective. Going by your logic I would conclude since the grid style epg started with newspaper it would be the better format, so why don't you just ask for a printed grid style epg. And since some use to use hangers as antennas why don't they supply those also. By the way I like how you took the weak people thing and twisted it, very impressive. Taking things and twisting them is that a learned behavior or does it come naturally. Why don't we make the triangle tires be a grid style epg

There is no other way to display information that a GRID (spreadsheet) EPG does anywhere near remotely as efficient. GRID EPG is the most efficient at displaying the amount of data for whats on now next and future for each specific channel....There is no other way around it there is no "vehicle" to deliver this information that isnt a Grid EPG thats why spreadsheets exist. You can indeed find out what is on right now and maybe coming up next but what about after that??? how would you find that out for the one specific channel even???? take for instance my kids watch some cartoons on NickJr but after a while toward the evening on weekdays the shows switch over to more adult/tv land type shows now rather than me having to remember exactly what channels switch format when im picking out shows for them to watch i have a grid epg i can see hey look its team umizoomi followed by paw patrol followed by GEORGE LOPEZ??? ok not a winner for channel selection... and i sure as hell dont want to go to each individual channel to see what is on for the next 3 hours either again at a glance i can compare (due to the blocking of kids channels) Disney Jr, Nick Jr, Disney XD, Sprout and a few others all at the same times and pick the one that best suits my needs for that time..... Without a Grid EPG to put all those channels with whats on now next and even later in one place how would you figure out what channel to "set and forget" thats the only style of set and forget i am interested in this dvr idea of set and forget is well ridiculous who doesnt set and forget already? i mean seriously? Clearly you cannot see beyond your liking for SD and trying to defend their poor decisions.

[bobitha]

Yes and no. I'm very much in the "let's not act like the sky is falling" camp, but both sides have merit.

The usefulness of a grid PG guide most definitely is subjective.

usefulness Does not equal efficiency I SAID that a grid epg is the most efficient means to display the guide data for all channels that are available to know what is on and whats on next and so on there is not a more efficient means to do so. THAT IS NOT SUBJECTIVE. Thank you

[GIJOE4LIFE]

What does my finances have to do with how guide data is displayed in a program? Anyway if the way the data is displayed needs to be tweaked, you make suggestions for improving it. Why demand a grid style epg as if it's the perfect vehicle to display tv data, it is not. A stone wheel on a car is a grid style epg, something better would have air in it. You can't seem to understand air in wheels are better. Period its not even subjective. Going by your logic I would conclude since the grid style epg started with newspaper it would be the better format, so why don't you just ask for a printed grid style epg. And since some use to use hangers as antennas why don't they supply those also. By the way I like how you took the weak people thing and twisted it, very impressive. Taking things and twisting them is that a learned behavior or does it come naturally. Why don't we make the triangle tires be a grid style epg

Yes and no. I'm very much in the "let's not act like the sky is falling" camp, but both sides have merit.

The usefulness of a grid PG guide most definitely is subjective. It will vary greatly depending on your viewing habits. I happen to fall in the camp of people that will miss the familiarity of it, but should be fine without it. That doesn't mean other people don't rely on it much more than I do. I can certainly see situations where people use it more that I do. To be honest I was somewhat skeptical of how prolific those usage cases are, and i suppose I still am to a degree (I suspect a lot of people are worrying a lot more over the outlier cases than than routine operation) but I don't deny that there are cases where using a grid guide would be better nore convenient or maybe even necessary.

That said, even for those spots, I'm still curious to see what SD delivers, since my understanding of things is that the Search and "now showing" methods are not the only things being developed.

The points you make I can agree with. I want to see what is delivered. I've WMC since the early days but I realize also that if MS had designed some other type of epg I would have gotten used to that also. If it's better than grid more power to them. I want the function first and worry about the beauty later.

[bobitha]

I want the function first and worry about the beauty later.

GRID EPG = Function...

[volfan6415]

Ok a grid style epg has one use and one use only. Looking for what is on right now and what is coming up in the future. I have never used the grid epg to "discover new series to record" that is what the Internet is for.

If I find a new series I want to record I go and search for it in the add TV section, I don't navigate the epg.

A grid style epg in my opinion has no place in a dvr where the only purpose is to record programs and then play them back at a later date. That is why silicon dust has developed so far is a set it and forget it dvr. You setup recordings and then you watch what had been recorded.

I'm not saying silicon dust doesn't need to add a grid style epg to the final player product, I don't understand the vitriol like they have taken away your first born son. I agree the live TV option needs a grid syle epg and if it doesn't have it will be lacking. But this doesn't mean that the dvr backend needs this feature.

[ajhieb]

usefulness Does not equal efficiency I SAID that a grid epg is the most efficient means to display the guide data for all channels that are available to know what is on and whats on next and so on there is not a more efficient means to do so. THAT IS NOT SUBJECTIVE. Thank you

Settle down tough guy. I was replying to someone else, not you, and I was defending your side in that statement.

That said, what I stated was correct. The usefulness of a grid style guide most certainly is subjective. different people have different viewing needs. I can state that I have no need for a guide. I hardly ever use the one in WMC now, as I've already setup my recording schedule, and don't generally rely on live TV for "I need to be entertained without changing the channel for the next 3 hours" scenarios. As already stated you do need a guide for your setup so it absolutely is subjective.

[Ed]

Ok a grid style epg has one use and one use only FOR ME.

FTFY

[volfan6415]

I'm just piping in so that you have another data point on the support side of the lack of grid epg isn't that big of a deal camp.

[bobitha]

usefulness Does not equal efficiency I SAID that a grid epg is the most efficient means to display the guide data for all channels that are available to know what is on and whats on next and so on there is not a more efficient means to do so. THAT IS NOT SUBJECTIVE. Thank you

Settle down tough guy. I was replying to someone else, not you, and I was defending your side in that statement.

That said, what I stated was correct. The usefulness of a grid style guide most certainly is subjective. different people have different viewing needs. I can state that I have no need for a guide. I hardly ever use the one in WMC now, as I've already setup my recording schedule, and don't generally rely on live TV for "I need to be entertained without changing the channel for the next 3 hours" scenarios. As already stated you do need a guide for your setup so it absolutely is subjective.

Whether or not a Grid EPG is "NEEDED" is Subjective absolutely person to person/household. But Spreadsheet being most efficient for displaying the type of data for whats on up next and so on is not subjective as the most efficient. Hopefully you can see that you took what i said out of context and now realize that for someone looking for that information a GRID EPG is a must have (subjective) and the fact that a GRID EPG is the only way to display that information efficiently is not subjective.
LOL you had quoted ME though maybe not by quotes but in your reference of it being subjective... ... SO i am responding because the statement i made is still a fact and not something that can be biased about. Displaying live tv, whats on next and future a Grid EPG is the most efficient that is just a fact there is no other way to display all the channels whats on now and in the future any more efficiently than Grid EPG. But if you go back you will see you had quoted me... Im not being a tough guy by the way Internet tough guys are a dime a dozen i was just pointing out that what you responded to was taken out of proper context.

[Ed]

I'm just piping in so that you have another data point on the support side of the lack of grid epg isn't that big of a deal camp.

That's fine, that side can use all the help it get at this point. Everyone who feels like you do should chime in. Everyone who feels opposite you should chime in.

[bobitha]

I'm just piping in so that you have another data point on the support side of the lack of grid epg isn't that big of a deal camp.

Condoms, Car insurance, House insurance, grid epg, a gun perhaps.... All things i do not NEED but i would rather have and not need than need and not have..

Do not get me wrong, i do like the features of like "new series" to be able to add to the dvr recordings when looking for something new i havent heard of... the "now showing" might even have its uses not a total dud... None of these features for my household will outweigh the need for a traditional grid epg...

[ajhieb]

LOL you had quoted ME though..... SO i am responding because the statement i made is still a fact and not something that can be biased about. Displaying live tv, whats on next and future a Grid EPG is the most efficient that is just a fact there is no other way to display all the channels whats on now and in the future any more efficiently than Grid EPG. But if you go back you will see you had quoted me... Im not being a tough guy by the way Internet tough guys are a dime a dozen i was just pointing out that what you responded to was taken out of proper context.

No, I hadn't quoted you (until you had already responded to me) I quoted GIJOE4LIFE and was responding to him. You then quoted me and replied to me as if I was addressing you which I wasn't. I was clearly addressing GIJOE4LIFE.

And you continue to try and correct me as if what I stated was wrong, and it's not. I said that people's need for a grid guide is subjective, and it is. I don't care about spreadsheets. I don't care about wheels. I don't care about circles or triangles. i'm saying that usage cases vary from person to person which means that the people who say they need a grid are just as right as the ones who say they don't.

[bobitha]

LOL you had quoted ME though..... SO i am responding because the statement i made is still a fact and not something that can be biased about. Displaying live tv, whats on next and future a Grid EPG is the most efficient that is just a fact there is no other way to display all the channels whats on now and in the future any more efficiently than Grid EPG. But if you go back you will see you had quoted me... Im not being a tough guy by the way Internet tough guys are a dime a dozen i was just pointing out that what you responded to was taken out of proper context.

No, I hadn't quoted you (until you had already responded to me) I quoted GIJOE4LIFE and was responding to him. You then quoted me and replied to me as if I was addressing you which I wasn't. I was clearly addressing GIJOE4LIFE.

And you continue to try and correct me as if what I stated was wrong, and it's not. I said that people's need for a grid guide is subjective, and it is. I don't care about spreadsheets. I don't care about wheels. I don't care about circles or triangles. i'm saying that usage cases vary from person to person which means that the people who say they need a grid are just as right as the ones who say they don't.

Alright, well then I am Sorry for directly quoting you. It looked as though you were quoting me when i said that Spreadsheet for guide data being most effiecient was not subjective.. My apologies

[GIJOE4LIFE]

What does my finances have to do with how guide data is displayed in a program? Anyway if the way the data is displayed needs to be tweaked, you make suggestions for improving it. Why demand a grid style epg as if it's the perfect vehicle to display tv data, it is not. A stone wheel on a car is a grid style epg, something better would have air in it. You can't seem to understand air in wheels are better. Period its not even subjective. Going by your logic I would conclude since the grid style epg started with newspaper it would be the better format, so why don't you just ask for a printed grid style epg. And since some use to use hangers as antennas why don't they supply those also. By the way I like how you took the weak people thing and twisted it, very impressive. Taking things and twisting them is that a learned behavior or does it come naturally. Why don't we make the triangle tires be a grid style epg

There is no other way to display information that a GRID (spreadsheet) EPG does anywhere near remotely as efficient. GRID EPG is the most efficient at displaying the amount of data for whats on now next and future for each specific channel....There is no other way around it there is no "vehicle" to deliver this information that isnt a Grid EPG thats why spreadsheets exist. You can indeed find out what is on right now and maybe coming up next but what about after that??? how would you find that out for the one specific channel even???? take for instance my kids watch some cartoons on NickJr but after a while toward the evening on weekdays the shows switch over to more adult/tv land type shows now rather than me having to remember exactly what channels switch format when im picking out shows for them to watch i have a grid epg i can see hey look its team umizoomi followed by paw patrol followed by GEORGE LOPEZ??? ok not a winnner for channel selection....and i sure as hell dont want to go to each individual channel to see what is on for the next 3 hours either again at a glance i can compare (due to the blocking of kids channels) Disney Jr, Nick Jr, Disney XD, Sprout and a few others all at the same times and pick the one that best suits my needs for that time.... Without a Grid EPG to put all those channels with whats on now next and even later in one place how would you figure out what channel to "set and forget" thats the only style of set and forget i am interested in this dvr idea of set and forget is well ridiculous who doesnt set and forget already? i mean seriously? Clearly you cannot see beyond your liking for SD and trying to defend their poor decisions.

A HORSE HAS HORSEPOWER, there is no other way to get around than a horse and buggy anywhere as efficient. My point is to say something the only way to do something because it's the only way YOU know, does not make it so. In the kids example I've found they know the names of every show they watch, I search for team umizoomi, there it is. I did not learn that george lopez show or any other adult show came on because of the grid style epg, I learned it because they announced on the channel they're watching. How can kids watch tv if I'm spending all the time scrolling through a grid. I do a search for the shows they watch see the time they come on and schedule it accordingly. Sometimes I record the shows on certain days they can watch them at specific times. Sometimes I use the TWC App on an android box and it does not have a grid style epg at all, in some ways its closer to the SD one, and I do a search, and there it is. Sounds like what would be better is a children s category like there is a sports category.There are a thousand ways to do things. I go through some of the same things you go I just try to have an open mind. I want to see the final guide style and submit ideas for improvement to have a better guide than a grid. I rarely if ever use a grid style epg, I don't even use the one in wmc, I get more information and faster online then scrolling through a Grid style guide. I find out about new shows search for them in wmc and schedule them to record. Add to that the number of channels in the grid are just too bulky.