Official: No WMC in Win 10

Discussion of getting WMC to work on Windows 10 (unsupported)
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STC

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Re: Official: No WMC in Win 10

#201

Post by STC » Tue Jun 16, 2015 3:28 am

Yep that was low quality witticism.
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#202

Post by paqman3d » Tue Jun 16, 2015 7:11 am

adam1991 wrote:
Sure, the set up was a pain in the butt (I knew more about CableCARD than Time Warner several times), but it works now. I was looking forward to upgrading to 10, but the death of WMC has gutted me...Gotta hold on to some hope, because this is very depressing
Why?

Why?

Why were you looking forward to upgrading YOUR DVR to Windows 10? Let me ask you this: do you look forward to upgrading the controller in your refrigerator?

Why does NOT being able to upgrade YOUR DVR to Windows 10 gut and depress you?

What would upgrading YOUR DVR to Windows 10 give you that Win8 (or Win7) can't give you AS A DVR?
Huh? Is it wrong I was actually looking forward to other new features of the OS and updated apps to use along side WMC? I don't get why you're jumping down my throat with this.

Why does this make me upset? Well, gee, there's the $2k I dropped on this rig not even a year and a half ago built fully with the intention of running live TV/DVR, Netflix/Hulu, Steam games, and housing my music collection all in one box. Taking WMC away with 10 doesn't make my PC useless, but it defeats the purpose of why I built it in the first place if I can't watch TV on it how I intended. And to your dig about refrigerators, if I built them, yes I'd look forward to upgrading that crap, too. Considering every OS since XP has had WMC, I figured it'd be a no brainer 10 got it. When I saw it in the preview version, I thought it was a sealed deal. I figured at worse they'd make me buy it again, but to just up and get rid of it caught me by surprise.

And to those that suggested dual booting, that's really going to make my girlfriend hate me if I try to explain that she has to switch operating systems to watch the newest episode of Botched. Not only that, wouldn't it completely miss my DVR recordings if I was booted into 10 playing a game? Not very user friendly, IMO.

The only thing I could think of that wouldn't drive me up a wall would be re-purposing an old build of mine into an 8.1 machine in my office, then throwing an Xbox 360 back out in my living room and use it as an extender over my network. I'd still keep my WMC set up and current cable bill price, it's just going to have to be on another desktop (which stinks). To me, staying up to date with gaming (DirectX12) trumps holding on to my ideal HTPC set up. As long as the guide still gets updated, I'll find a way to keep WMC in my life.

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#203

Post by tony_park » Tue Jun 16, 2015 10:05 am

Mpgrimm2 wrote:@DavidinCT,
I would give you a :thumbup: if I could, and hope you continue to tinker with patching WMC into win10 ( I've been watching your thread).

I see the glass as half full here vs empty as to whether or not there can be an effect from consumer influence on the fate of our much beloved WMC. Sure it might be a waste of time, but until win10 is final and released why not see how big the WMC base is (7.5 Million i read somewhere) and how loud people can crow about it vs discourage it.

PC World - Here's how user feedback is shaping Windows 10
It would be great if MS would actually allow feedback from non-windows 10 users, so that we could request MC be included as many times as possible. Not sure how many win10 beta users actually use MC, so the figure may be a small % of those testing the new OS.

Personally, I'm considering moving to windows 10 and using Kodi, as our tuner software works well with it, the only aspect we would miss, would be blu ray playback - but a cheap blu ray player would solve that one! I may give it a try, and see how we get on, I can always restore from a backup and go back to windows 7 if we don't get on with it.

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#204

Post by adam1991 » Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:47 pm

paqman, there's a saying: tuition in the school of life is not free.

You've been schooled. Righteously, too. To expect that WMC would continue, AND to put that kind of money into a rig based on those expectations that came out of thin air, was a mistake most people would have avoided.

Toss in the fact that Ceton dumped the Q probably based on information about this a couple of years ago, and there you have it.

And the only cost to solving the problem is to have a separate DVR? That bit of tuition is as good as free.

You sound as upset as if your best friend had died. This is just computers, and it's nothing to get that anxious and upset about.

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#205

Post by mceguy... » Wed Jun 17, 2015 7:26 am

What I think is strange, is that everyone here "sounds" like they've already switched to Windows 10... I for one have no intentions of doing that, if MS wants to phase out Win 7, I have until 2020 to figure out what to do then... I can wait, can they?

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#206

Post by mike_ekim » Wed Jun 17, 2015 4:06 pm

paqman3d wrote: Huh? Is it wrong I was actually looking forward to other new features of the OS and updated apps to use along side WMC?
What new Windows 10 features and updated apps were you looking forward to using "along side WMC"? Just curious. So far I haven't seen anything new in Windows 10 that I would want to add to my HTPC, but maybe there is something I missed. If I were to build, for example, a Kodi box is there something specific to Windows 10 that I might want?

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#207

Post by Ed  » Wed Jun 17, 2015 4:21 pm

mike_ekim wrote:What new Windows 10 features and updated apps were you looking forward to using "along side WMC"? Just curious. So far I haven't seen anything new in Windows 10 that I would want to add to my HTPC, but maybe there is something I missed. If I were to build, for example, a Kodi box is there something specific to Windows 10 that I might want?
You're making the mistake that what and only what would be of importance/relevance to you would be the only thing important or relevant at all/to anyone. He has his own tastes/wants/needs/interests - so obviously there is something in it for him - because he said there is - whether or not there is for you as well.

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#208

Post by Mpgrimm2 » Thu Jun 18, 2015 1:53 am

Someone over at the MS Community Page for Win 10 MCE posted a Straw Poll. Feel free to vote if you are so inclined:
laffreuxpwet replied on June 16 wrote: This is the end a my most comfortable TV experience on my computer.

If we could do something, this may use consumers feedback. Let's try to move MS towards a return of MCE in Windows 10.

Massively share this on your social tools with #SaveWMCE hashtag.

Click and vote, make things move :

How are you using Media Center?

What would you tell MS about the demise of Media Center?

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#209

Post by DavidinCT » Thu Jun 18, 2015 9:05 pm

It is NOW official. I downloaded Windows 10 build 10147, The Windows Media Center files are no longer included in this build. The last build all the files were there (so you could modify the ISO and install it, this would no longer work on this build)

I have been extracting the WMC deployment files from each build in hopes to add it to RTM, this is the first build where they removed the files....
-Dave
Twitter @TheCoolDave

Windows Media Center certified and WMC MVP 2010 - 2012

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#210

Post by spud72 » Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:56 pm

DavidinCT wrote:It is NOW official. I downloaded Windows 10 build 10147, The Windows Media Center files are no longer included in this build. The last build all the files were there (so you could modify the ISO and install it, this would no longer work on this build)

I have been extracting the WMC deployment files from each build in hopes to add it to RTM, this is the first build where they removed the files....
Did it work ok in previous builds - if it did it is surprising that it is being removed - if it didn't work it may be a bit more understandable.

There is nothing as good as WMC out there - it would be nice if MS listen to its customers.

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#211

Post by Sharks » Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:26 pm

spud72 wrote:
DavidinCT wrote:It is NOW official. I downloaded Windows 10 build 10147, The Windows Media Center files are no longer included in this build. The last build all the files were there (so you could modify the ISO and install it, this would no longer work on this build)

I have been extracting the WMC deployment files from each build in hopes to add it to RTM, this is the first build where they removed the files....
Did it work ok in previous builds - if it did it is surprising that it is being removed - if it didn't work it may be a bit more understandable.

There is nothing as good as WMC out there - it would be nice if MS listen to its customers.
Yes, David and Shark007 have both had it running in Dev Previews for quite awhile.

Everyone be sure to blast Microsoft's and Satya Nadella's twitter with your displeasure. @satyanadella & @Microsoft.

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#212

Post by Tourniquet » Sun Jun 21, 2015 5:09 pm

DavidinCT wrote:It is NOW official. I downloaded Windows 10 build 10147, The Windows Media Center files are no longer included in this build. The last build all the files were there (so you could modify the ISO and install it, this would no longer work on this build)

I have been extracting the WMC deployment files from each build in hopes to add it to RTM, this is the first build where they removed the files....
Even though I didn't test it with 10147 I was pretty sure it would be removed in this build. They cleaned up / prepared the the SKUs for the final release so they cut it out.

How did you extract the WMC files excatly? And is there a way to install them yet?

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DavidinCT

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#213

Post by DavidinCT » Mon Jun 22, 2015 3:05 pm

There is a few tools on another site that allowed me to do this (thanks to another member here). There is no way to install/import them yet. Microsoft's packages need to be installed into the right version of the OS. As each update is a different version, it will not install (gives me a wont apply to this version error). Trying to figure out a way to work through this but, with out luck at this point.

People be vocal on Twitter and facebook. I have been but, with very little re-tweets :(
-Dave
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Windows Media Center certified and WMC MVP 2010 - 2012

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#214

Post by zambine » Mon Jun 22, 2015 5:32 pm

DavidinCT wrote:Then the possible end of life getting shortened. This could be a problem for a lot of people. Microsoft has been known to move "end of life" dates on Windows, depending on usage. I'm not really worried about 7, I am kind of worried about 8/8.1, As 10 hits, more people will remove 8.1 and move to 10. Microsoft could drop the 2023 date and drop it down to 2018, or even lower. They did it before with Vista and XP (changing dates) this could be a problem for a lot of people.
Hi! New member and long time stalker of this forum.

This issue that the EOL could be changed really concerns me.

I currently have Win 7 running perfectly on a dedicated HTPC for almost 3 years now. I never upgraded to Win 8 due to MS removing the Media Center auto start feature which was not very wife friendly.

I have been thinking about upgrading to Win 8.1 now due to the possible extended EOL of 2023 compared to Win 7. (I realize guide data could get shut down any time but security patches are also important to keep current)

David - you have me thinking now with your comment above that since Win 7 has a MUCH bigger user base that its EOL of 2020 might be more solid than that of Win 8's 2023.

My other concern would be if I do not get an upgrade license key soon for Win 8 MS will discontinue the option of upgrading to Win 8 to force people onto Win 10 and then I will have lost 3 extra years of WMC with a supported OS that I could have had.

Is anyone who is currently on Win 7 considering upgrading to Win 8 due to the increased EOL support Microsoft announced? Are there any other reasons not to upgrade?

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#215

Post by LuckyDay » Mon Jun 22, 2015 5:54 pm

First, I would like to know an instance where Microsoft has decided to change the EOL of a product after announcing the actual date. They may announce closer dates for less used products, but once the date is set, they always stick to it.

Second, WMC will continue to work indefinitely beyond these EOL dates. The only thing that changes Microsoft won't officially support the OS. I would make an argument Microsoft hasn't supported WMC in years, so I don't see why this is a great issue.

If your goal is to keep WMC for as long as possible and not worry about OS upgrades just get on 7/8 and don't worry about it.

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#216

Post by ajhieb » Mon Jun 22, 2015 6:06 pm

I'm sticking with Win7 for the time being, because it works. I've never been a proponent of upgrading to a new OS because it's a new OS.

While I have nothing but common sense to back this up (which doesn't make it a lock when MS is involved) I'm operating under the assumption that the guide data won't be OS dependent. It will either work or it won't, regardless of which version of Windows you have. So that isn't a compelling reason to switch. I also use my HTPC strictly as an appliance. In my case security updates really aren't that important to me. TBH antivirus really isn't that important on their either. But if it was more of a multi-purpose PC I would be more worried about security patches. But on my HTPC I have Windows Update disabled, so the prospect of missing out on updates isn't good motivation for me.

Also keep in mind at this point I'm also considering a move to SD-PVR system if it turns out to be successful, so that is my primary plan for the long term, but if that doesn't turn out to be viable, I'm still sticking with Win7.

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#217

Post by zambine » Mon Jun 22, 2015 6:46 pm

Thanks for the opinions guys. It's good to know that MS sticks to their EOL dates. David's quote implied that they did change EOL on Vista and XP. That definitely has made me think more on this. :idea:

Yes, my goal is to keep WMC as long as possible without added security risk.

I use my HTPC for web browsing, playing movie collection on my NAS, Pandora, and other various streaming shows/services. I also expect the guide data in Win 7 to work after EOL but that obviously requires an active internet connection in order to update automatically as well. In short, I'm never going to disconnect my HTPC from the internet and keep it only on my home network. (wife would kill me as well)

Assuming the EOL dates remain the same, the way I see it after 2020 on Win 7 I will possibly be vulnerable to any new security threats that may come along. I work in IT and see hackers/malware issues causing havoc on a weekly basis. At work we are in the process of converting the last of our Win Server 2003 boxes due to it's impending EOL next month. We simply cannot run an unsupported OS, even on internal servers, due to security threats and no support from MS.

I understand that new options like the SD-PVR should be out there before 2020 but I would want to wait on those until at least their 2nd generation to make sure the bugs are all worked out. WMC works too seamlessly right now for me to abandon it without very good reason. Any added complexities/performance issues from a new piece of hardware would just infuriate me and the wife.

I think I am leaning towards installing Win 8 simply for the extended OS support but I do welcome any other opinions.

On a side note: Are there any hurdles with WMC on Win 8 vs Win 7 besides the removal of the auto-launch at startup feature?

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#218

Post by mike_ekim » Mon Jun 22, 2015 7:04 pm

Ed  wrote:
mike_ekim wrote:What new Windows 10 features and updated apps were you looking forward to using "along side WMC"? Just curious. So far I haven't seen anything new in Windows 10 that I would want to add to my HTPC, but maybe there is something I missed. If I were to build, for example, a Kodi box is there something specific to Windows 10 that I might want?
You're making the mistake that what and only what would be of importance/relevance to you would be the only thing important or relevant at all/to anyone. He has his own tastes/wants/needs/interests - so obviously there is something in it for him - because he said there is - whether or not there is for you as well.
Nope, you seem to have misinterpreted my post. My question was sincere.

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#219

Post by mdavej » Mon Jun 22, 2015 7:11 pm

zambine wrote:Are there any hurdles with WMC on Win 8 vs Win 7 besides the removal of the auto-launch at startup feature?
Since you're in IT, I assume you already know that Win 8 has no start menu, so is much more difficult to navigate (outside of WMC) without a keyboard than Win 7. Also, Win 8 only works with Xbox 360 extenders, whereas Win 7 works with all extenders. I personally wouldn't wish Win 8 on my worst enemy. I ran it on my HTPC for a few months, but ultimately re-installed Win 7.

Why are you compelled to upgrade now, on the eve of the Win 10 launch, rather 5 years from now when Win 7 EOL actually occurs? Could you not just buy a Win 8 license today and keep it on the shelf until you absolutely have to use it?

Keep in mind that business have vastly different security needs than home users. You and your family probably know not to visit questionable websites or open suspicious emails, whereas many business users may not. Plus the loss to a business can be huge, so they have to be very conservative. Your risk of anything bad happening to even an unsupported OS in your home, on the other hand, is extremely low. Many WMC users don't run any anti-virus software at all because the risk is practically non-existent when you use it like an appliance.

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#220

Post by mdavej » Mon Jun 22, 2015 7:14 pm

mike_ekim wrote:What new Windows 10 features and updated apps were you looking forward to using "along side WMC"? Just curious. So far I haven't seen anything new in Windows 10 that I would want to add to my HTPC, but maybe there is something I missed. If I were to build, for example, a Kodi box is there something specific to Windows 10 that I might want?
I've asked the same question in other threads, and all I get is "DirectX 12". Seems many HTPC users also game on their machines and simply cannot live with DirectX 12. It is apparently so awesome that it's worth losing WMC over.

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