Ceton InfiniTV6 ETH Bad Tuners

[joelkirzner]

I'm not sure, but why did I have no issues with my old networked InfiniTV 4? Now things are all pixelated and jittery? Same NICs, switches etc.

Because you had the InfiniTV tuners installed in the PC's with the 100 megabit NIC's. In that configuration, the data was flowing from the PC's 100Mb NIC to the switch. When a 100Mb NIC feeds data to a gigabit switch, buffering and flow control are not as important because the switch can deliver the data to the gigabit clients faster than the 100 megabit server can send it.

Now, you have it hooked up to flow the other direction. Now, it's possible for the Ethernet-attached tuner to supply data faster than the 100 megabit NIC can handle it. Without flow control enabled, you will miss some packets. With flow control enabled, the packets should buffer in switch. If the switch's buffer isn't large enough, it will overflow, and you will miss some packets.

That makes sense! Can you advise on how to enable flow control... I've never dealt with that.

Thanks so much!

[barnabas1969]

I don't think adding another switch in the middle with help anything. If anything, you'll just add more network latency, which can cause problems too. It would be best if all of your PC's and your tuner were connected to the same switch (not using the router as a switch, because routers have a habit of inspecting packets between the router's wired ports, thus causing more latency).

Try enabling flow control on the two PC's. Then, if that doesn't help, look at the specs of the switch to see how much buffer memory. I can't tell you exactly how much buffer memory is needed, but I've used a switch with a 1Mb buffer, and it worked fine. I've seen reports of switches with less than this causing a problem with network tuners and extenders.

You enable flow control in Control Panel -> Network and Sharing Center -> Change Adapter Settings -> right-click on your network adapter, and choose Properties -> Click the "Configure" button -> Click the "Advanced" tab, select "Flow control" and set the value to Enable/On. Click OK.

[joelkirzner]

I don't think adding another switch in the middle with help anything. If anything, you'll just add more network latency, which can cause problems too. It would be best if all of your PC's and your tuner were connected to the same switch (not using the router as a switch, because routers have a habit of inspecting packets between the router's wired ports, thus causing more latency).

Try enabling flow control on the two PC's. Then, if that doesn't help, look at the specs of the switch to see how much buffer memory. I can't tell you exactly how much buffer memory is needed, but I've used a switch with a 1Mb buffer, and it worked fine. I've seen reports of switches with less than this causing a problem with network tuners and extenders.

You enable flow control in Control Panel -> Network and Sharing Center -> Change Adapter Settings -> right-click on your network adapter, and choose Properties -> Click the "Configure" button -> Click the "Advanced" tab, select "Flow control" and set the value to Enable/On. Click OK.

I'll definitely try the flow control setting when I get home later.

If I just replace the old NICs with gigabit NICs, do you think that will solve the problem? One of the computers is a desktop, so the NIC is like $10. The other is a laptop, which I know they have gigabit USB NICs for $25-$30... just wondering if that throughput is enough via USB 2.0.

Thanks!

[barnabas1969]

It's possible that replacing the NIC with a gigabit NIC will help, but no guarantee. USB 2.0 runs at a max theoretical speed of 480Mbps. And, if you install a gigabit NIC in a PCI slot (instead of PCIe), you won't get gigabit speeds either.

If the flow control setting is already enabled, or doesn't help, then I'd recommend...

1) Dedicate a different set of tuners to those two PC's to see if it makes a difference.
2) Replace the switch with a better one (with more buffer memory).

It's best to start with what's easy and free, and then work your way up to more difficult/expensive options.

[TeddyR]

My "green" switch works just fine. I don't understand why the "green" feature would make it not work well with network tuners and extenders. All it really does is reduce power consumed by ports that don't have a link established with another device.

It may not affect your particular combination of NIC/EEE switch.

I have been able to reproduce the issue with the SD devices with at least 3 brands/models of switches and 2 brands of nics. There are other devices that are also affected like an IP based Security Camera that I have as well.

The issue is with some implementations of EEE is that they do not consider UDP packets (I believe multicast since they are not directed at a particular port) in the calculation for "active link" and the link goes into "low power" mode momentarily when a stream is technically active thus dropping the link to WMC.

Intels official comment (http://downloadmirror.intel.com/18713/eng/readme.txt) :

Link flap when Energy Efficient Ethernet is enabled
---------------------------------------------------
Some switches do not support Energy Efficient Ethernet (EEE) correctly. Make
sure your switch is loaded with the latest firmware. Disabling EEE on your
adapter may resolve this issue.

[joelkirzner]

So last night I took Barnabas's advice and tried the simplest and cheapest route... I checked the flow control under the adapter settings, rebooted the computers and I still was having quality issues.

I then decided to power cycle the trendnet switch.

Lo and behold, things instantly cleared up!

I think I'm good now with the Ceton. I did have to repair the cablecard with Comcast with the new Host ID... not a big deal. I think the cable companies are actually getting better with dealing with cablecard self installs and authorizations.

In other news, my PlayReady DRM completely broke on my desktop that used to have the InfiniTV 4 PCIe. I spent hours trying to fix it so I could actually watch protected content like HBO, Cinemax etc. I gave up and reformatted the computer. It's too bad Microsoft has such strict restrictions when changing out hardware.

[JazJon]

Interesting, I'm glad I'm still following this thread. My roommate wants to replace the 5-port gigabit switch in the garage with a new one that has more port. (probably an 8-port) I told him to make sure he buys one that does NOT have "Green Ethernet" technology. Things are working great, so I'd hate to introduce something that suddenly caused pixelation.

[WScottCross]

I'm having severe problems with losing tuners and it seems to get worse the longer I use it. I pointed a fan at it to see if it was temperature related and it appears to make no difference. I hooked my PC and the ETH6 on 2 different switches and one of them resolved the issue. It appears that my D-Link 24 port DGS-1024D and an 8 port Trendnet TEG-S8 both cause issues for the ETH6. My trusty old 5 port Netgear Prosafe GS-105 works great.

I really don't want to replace my 24 port whole house switch. My 2 HDHomerun Primes (6 tuners total) worked just fine on this switch for months. Come on Ceton, get the "green" problem fixed!

[JazJon]

I'm having sever problems with losing tuners and it seems to get worse the longer I use it. I pointed a fan at it to see if it was temperature related and it appears to make no difference. I hooked my PC and the ETH6 on 2 different switches and one of them resolved the issue. It appears that my D-Link 24 port DGS-1024D and an 8 port Trendnet TEG-S8 both cause issues for the ETH6. My trusty 5 port Netgear Prosafe GS-105 works great.

I really don't want to replace my 24 port whole house switch. My 2 HDHomerun Primes (6 tuners total) worked just fine on this switch for months. Come on Ceton, get the "green" problem fixed!

Bummer so much for the first few smooth days. I'm having major pixelation problems on my Eth 6 the last 2 days. Example: http://youtu.be/leH5Lx8ex90

I just posted all my details here:
http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... 072#p52072

The only option I have left is trying to swap out the switches. Maybe I should order the Netgear Prosafe GS-108 (need 8 ports in my room) It's an expensive troubleshooting step though.

[WScottCross]

We shouldn't be forced to change out our switches. If the HDHR Primes can pass 6 streams through this hardware without issue, why can the ETH6?

[JazJon]

Update
after swapping my coax TAP outputs, I have POSITIVE dBvM now! (had negative/near 0 before) I guess I had my tap outputs backwards on which side output the stronger singnal. (TAP's are used when you don't want a 50/50 split)
http://i.imgur.com/nRjOPoM.jpg

This thread shows what else I've tried following the SiliconDust network troubleshooting tips.
http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... 129#p52129

So as I said, seems like things are ok for now, I won't know for sure until after the weekend when other shows record.

I'm not going to buy a new $50 switch just yet.

[WScottCross]

Well, After getting it all working on the Netgear switch, I moved the cables back over to the 24 port DLink and now that's working fine. There was something wonky, maybe the InfiniTV 6 needs to see several disconnects and reconnects, it appears that something got reset or something. I have no idea what happened but it's been working fine for a couple days now. I think I'm going to pound on it a few more days before I hook it up to the main WMC box just to make sure.

[barnabas1969]

Well, After getting it all working on the Netgear switch, I moved the cables back over to the 24 port DLink and now that's working fine. There was something wonky, maybe the InfiniTV 6 needs to see several disconnects and reconnects, it appears that something got reset or something. I have no idea what happened but it's been working fine for a couple days now. I think I'm going to pound on it a few more days before I hook it up to the main WMC box just to make sure.

Yep... it works on FM (you're gonna have to look that up, and I don't mean frequency modulation... the M stands for Magic. You can figure out the F).

[erkotz]

Update
after swapping my coax TAP outputs, I have POSITIVE dBvM now! (had negative/near 0 before) I guess I had my tap outputs backwards on which side output the stronger singnal. (TAP's are used when you don't want a 50/50 split)
http://i.imgur.com/nRjOPoM.jpg

This thread shows what else I've tried following the SiliconDust network troubleshooting tips.
http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... 129#p52129

So as I said, seems like things are ok for now, I won't know for sure until after the weekend when other shows record.

I'm not going to buy a new $50 switch just yet.

A cable TAP will have 3 (typically) jacks:
In, Out and something else (usually "tap" or -6dB or whatever)

They are for:
In - This is the source signal - from the cable operator
Out - This is the pass-through signal (would typically go to the next tap). Generally this will retain the majority of the signal strength
Tap/-XdB - this is the "tap" and will contain the source signal -x (so if it says -6dB, it will be 6dB lower than the input signal). You would typically connect the device here.

[JazJon]

Update
after swapping my coax TAP outputs, I have POSITIVE dBvM now! (had negative/near 0 before) I guess I had my tap outputs backwards on which side output the stronger singnal. (TAP's are used when you don't want a 50/50 split)
http://i.imgur.com/nRjOPoM.jpg

This thread shows what else I've tried following the SiliconDust network troubleshooting tips.
http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... 129#p52129

So as I said, seems like things are ok for now, I won't know for sure until after the weekend when other shows record.

I'm not going to buy a new $50 switch just yet.

A cable TAP will have 3 (typically) jacks:
In, Out and something else (usually "tap" or -6dB or whatever)

They are for:
In - This is the source signal - from the cable operator
Out - This is the pass-through signal (would typically go to the next tap). Generally this will retain the majority of the signal strength
Tap/-XdB - this is the "tap" and will contain the source signal -x (so if it says -6dB, it will be 6dB lower than the input signal). You would typically connect the device here.

Well in my case I only need two devices, the cable modem, and the infinitv 6 ETH. The rest of the house does not need coax. I guess I could use a regular splitter, but right now giving my infinitv the stronger "pass-through" output from my TAP gives me the best results. My cable modem seems to be fine on the weaker "tap". If I flip it around the other way, I have bad intermittent pixelation on certain channels.

[WScottCross]

Well, After getting it all working on the Netgear switch, I moved the cables back over to the 24 port DLink and now that's working fine. There was something wonky, maybe the InfiniTV 6 needs to see several disconnects and reconnects, it appears that something got reset or something. I have no idea what happened but it's been working fine for a couple days now. I think I'm going to pound on it a few more days before I hook it up to the main WMC box just to make sure.

Yep... it works on FM (you're gonna have to look that up, and I don't mean frequency modulation... the M stands for Magic. You can figure out the F).

I know all about FM. Troubleshooters nightmare. I guess I wasn't expecting to have to muck around with it so much. I bit the bullet and hooked it up to the main WMC box and it still seems fine. I'll hang on to the second HDHR Prime for a bit just to make sure.