Where are poster images are referenced? XMLTV file or XMF?

[MKANET]

EDIT: It looks like the poster images are references in the XMLTV file.. I just had to look further down into the file. However, I noticed that if I manually go to each one of these URLs, SD responds with ""Maximum image downloads reached. Counter resets every 24h.".

So, if I don't enable the EPG123 service + image caching... by the time the XMLTV consuming services tries to actually use the XMLTV file, none of the images are accessible on the same day. And, since these files are generated daily, these images will never be accessible by the XMLTV consuming service immediately after EPG123 creates the file. UNLESS the EPG123 service and image caching is enabled.

[garyan2]

No. Any and all images that are linked in the xmltv file will be available to you once your download counter resets.

Not running the service gives a high probability you will reach the 5,000/24 hour download limit especially for xmltv appliances.
Running the service without cache will reduce the probability of reaching the limit, but it is dependent on the appliance and if it caches downloaded images.
Running the service with cache significantly reduces the probability of reaching the limit.

When epg123 creates the mxf and xmltv files, there are no images downloaded. It doesn't count against the limit. The service will only request an image from SD if a client requests an image that is not already cached by the service.

[garyan2]

Also, the images are not generated daily. It is when you request an image from SD, it will redirect to where the images are with a token that expires in minutes. If there is no token, or the token is expired, you can't download the image. So it is only the token that changes and not the link to the image.

[MKANET]

... When epg123 creates the mxf and xmltv files, there are no images downloaded. It doesn't count against the limit. The service will only request an image from SD if a client requests an image that is not already cached by the service.

That's exactly what I wanted to know! I incorrectly thought that just obtaining the URL link only from SD counts as a download.

[MKANET]

Also, the images are not generated daily. It is when you request an image from SD, it will redirect to where the images are with a token that expires in minutes. If there is no token, or the token is expired, you can't download the image. So it is only the token that changes and not the link to the image.

Thanks for explaining that detail. Now it makes sense why EPG123 keeps track of SD tokens.

[MKANET]

Gary, I feel bad for asking so many questions.. I have one more related question:

As an experiment to understand how EPG123's service/image caching works...

I just had EPG123 generate an XMLTV file without EPG123's service and image caching enabled. I can see poster image URLs such as below mentioned in the XMLTV file:

Code: Select all

<icon src="https://json.schedulesdirect.org/......../image/5c1da9ffda835aae30874de3745c15adbcc269ff04396adffb32cae1b707f297.jpg" width="240" height="360"></icon>
<icon src="https://json.schedulesdirect.org/......../image/32f4b21ffdff7a857d294c00af13fa9771699cfd7c34c25a39ef160d2dc3f20a.jpg" width="270" height="360"></icon>
<icon src="https://json.schedulesdirect.org/......../image/f3f658f967c9a981411750f712d18d8903392a38e97d44674bd7bb4ce5a2c67f.jpg" width="360" height="270"></icon>
<icon src="https://json.schedulesdirect.org/......../image/a070fba2d938afbd9c11ca9f987073faf7be1b8aff69672ac2f947be3e89bf09.jpg" width="480" height="270"></icon>

Now, let's say tomorrow, I enable EPG123's service and image caching, and EPG123 generates a new XMLTV file.. would the poster links above look something like the below URLs instead? I'm trying to figure out how an XMLTV appliance would know where to get EPG123's cached image from.

Code: Select all

<icon src="https://myservershostname:9009/......../image/5c1da9ffda835aae30874de3745c15adbcc269ff04396adffb32cae1b707f297.jpg" width="240" height="360"></icon>
<icon src="https://myservershostname:9009/......../image/32f4b21ffdff7a857d294c00af13fa9771699cfd7c34c25a39ef160d2dc3f20a.jpg" width="270" height="360"></icon>
<icon src="https://myservershostname:9009/......../image/f3f658f967c9a981411750f712d18d8903392a38e97d44674bd7bb4ce5a2c67f.jpg" width="360" height="270"></icon>
<icon src="https://myservershostname:9009/......../image/a070fba2d938afbd9c11ca9f987073faf7be1b8aff69672ac2f947be3e89bf09.jpg" width="480" height="270"></icon>

[garyan2]

That is correct.

[MKANET]

Thanks! I was hoping so!

[SwissCheese]

Hi

Is there a way to edit existing image links in WMC that point
to https://json.schedulesdirect.org/ so they instead point to
the local https://myservershostname:9009/ ?

I have hundreds of recordings that were done before EPG123
had its own server, so they still try to retrieve images from SD.

Thank you

[Space]

I don't believe recordings have any link to any external images, they just use the image that is already cached in the WMC database.

If you are referring to recorded movies that are missing their poster art, unfortunately I don't think there is any way to get those images back (at least not yet) if the cached image has been removed from the WMC database.

There used to be an extended data server that was maintained by Microsoft that would provide extended data about movies (including poster art) that would allow the WMC movie library to have the extra data, but that went away a while ago and there has been no replacement (unlike the guide data feed and some other services that were replaced by EPG123).

[SwissCheese]

Hi

Thanks for the reply.
A few comments...

1) These are recent recordings, made within the past year, so
their images must come from SD and TMDB, not from MS.

2) If the SD server is unreachable, WMC displays blanks instead
of images, which implies WMC only stores image links not images.

If the link locations within WMCs databases were known, maybe
the links could be edited to point to images in the epg123
service cache instead of the SD server.

[Space]

Assuming you are talking about poster art for movies, there is no current way to populate those images once they are purged from the WMC database. If the movie poster art is available in the WMC guide at the time the movie is recorded, then it will store it in the WMC database at that time and will remain attached to your movie recording for as long as it remains in the recording folder and the WMC DB is not cleared. If the poster art is purged from the WMC database (database rebuild, garbage cleanup, etc.) it is gone forever and cannot be repopulated (at least there is no known way to do it).

As I mentioned, there used to be an extended metadata server that was run by Microsoft that would be able to re-populate the movie poster art (as well as other movie metadata) but that went away a few years ago, and there has been no replacement for it (although it may be possible for someone to create one if they had the will and skill to do so).

Check out this thread for additional information.

[SwissCheese]

Hi

Thanks for your reply.

I don't believe my image links have been purged.

If SD is reachable, and SD is still serving that image, then
the image displays properly in WMC.

If the SD server is unreachable, the image won't display in WMC.
When SD becomes reachable again the image does display again.

That makes me think there are links somewhere in a WMC database
that point to the SD image server.

So it seems possible that those links could be edited to point
to the epg123 image cache instead of the SD server.

[garyan2]

To understand the challenges, you need to understand how it is that WMC can show the artwork for recorded shows.

Problem #1:
When a show is recorded, the programs guide information to include the movie poster or series information with artwork is flagged in the database to not be removed. The "problem" is that information is tied to the recorded file. Some of the information gets stored in the file metadata but not the series/artwork. All this information is lost if there is a database recovery, or you perform a database rebuild or restore since it only resides in the database and it is deleted for these events/actions. This is also why sometimes if you move the recording file, or you remove the folder where it resides from your library, the images will get lost then as well.

Problem #2:
I think it was in the summer of 2021, Schedules Direct completely changed how they handle images and all the links and filenames were changed. This effectively made it impossible for WMC to download any images prior to when this occurred. Also with the change, because part of their solution was to provide redirects with a time limited token in the URI, it effectively breaks WMC image cache since it will cache the time limited link. Requesting the same image will result in getting a new redirect with a new token. The EPG123 service takes care of this and will allow the WMC cache to work (with or without caching enabled).

Problem #3:
As part of SD's plan to reduce costs and limit image downloads, they were planning to only allow image downloads that are linked to programs that exist in your current lineup(s)/channels. So if you recorded a movie last week or last year, and that movie is not currently listed in any channel of any lineup you are subscribed to, it won't be available to you. The EPG123 service will allow you to still use the WMC cache, and the service with cache enabled will allow you continually see the image up until it is purged from the service image cache. You may want to change the cache setting to indefinitely, but that could probably get quite large depending on your usage. NOTE: I need to verify if this problem is actually a current problem, or just a planned problem.

Solution:
None right now. It would have to be a completely different project to try and "rebuild" recorded shows with proper links in the database. Definitely not for the faint of heart and I'm not sure if it is possible.

[SwissCheese]

Wow! Thank you for the detailed reply...

"Problem #1:" Fortunately this hasn't been an issue for me, yet.

"Problem #2:" Yes, I noticed when hundreds of my old images suddenly
disappeared last summer.

"Problem #3:" Yes, I noticed when images for even recent recordings
disappeared, then sometimes reappeared weeks later.

The epg123 service fixes problems 2 and 3 very nicely but only
for new recordings and only for images from SD (not TMDB).

"Solution:...It would have to be a completely different project to try
and "rebuild" recorded shows with proper links in the database."

I'm hoping the old image links to "https://json.schedulesdirect.org/..."
are stored as plain text somewhere in a WMC database and that just
changing their text to "https://myservershostname:9009/..." will magically work.

[garyan2]

If you are not getting the image from the https://json.schedulesdirect.org link, then you won't get them from the https://myservershostname:9009 link either.

[SwissCheese]

Hi again, thank you for your comment...

"If you are not getting the image from the https://json.schedulesdirect.org link, then you won't get them from the https://myservershostname:9009 link either."

Yes, I understand that, but...
I have a few ideas on how to add images to the epg123 service cache.

One idea is to repurpose an existing unneeded link address in the cache
and just replace the contents of its jpg image file.

Another is to manually add a new link and new image jpg to the cache.
That's tricky because of the cache index structure, but looks doable
because the index is editable plain text.

Yet another way is to re-record the movie if it becomes available again
on cable TV and use its new link in the cache.

Why not just keep the new movie you might ask, well, because the cable
channel I record from puts out lower quality now than they did a year ago.

[garyan2]

Not sure exactly what you are trying to do, but you don't need to repurpose any links in the cache. A nice feature of the cache is the link doesn't need to be in the cache index file to work. When the service gets a request, it will check the cache as it knows it, then check to see if the file exists. If the file exists, but is not in the cache file, it will be added automatically and the file provided to the requesting client. You will have to place the file in the proper location based on the first character of the filename.

Just be aware that any manually added images to the cache will follow the same retention rules that all the other cached files follow.

[SwissCheese]

Hi

Thank you for the reply.

>> "Not sure exactly what you are trying to do"

I'm hoping to get images back for recordings made before I installed
the epg123 service.

The image links for those recordings point to the SD server, and I
would like to locate and change the links to point to the epg123
service instead.

>> "If the file exists, but is not in the cache file, it will be added automatically"

That's great!

[Hi-Def_PCs]

To understand the challenges, you need to understand how it is that WMC can show the artwork for recorded shows.

Solution:
None right now. It would have to be a completely different project to try and "rebuild" recorded shows with proper links in the database. Definitely not for the faint of heart and I'm not sure if it is possible.

Gary, first I must say that your work on EPG123 is amazing!

And I believe the Recorded TV HD addin comes very close to a real solution. Even on my new Win 7 install, all my poster art for TV movies and TV series are still intact, because RTVHD is not WMC dependent in any way. So good in fact, that I used Media Center Studio to hide the WMC movie library link full of colored boxes in favor of RTVHD's movie library link. MCS can even rename and change the order of the WMC start menu too! WMC movie guide was retained and its menu header renamed TV Movie Guide. Someone needs to update the Wiki for RTVHD, because a link goes nowhere and the patch file is not linked, but I did stumble across it in the original RTVHD post string.

Thank you for your contributions to the WMC cause!