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Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:38 pm
by hammerash
I have been using WMC for over 5 years using a HD Home Run Prime and a cable card. I resisted the upgrade to windows 10 on all my computers because of WMC. But with 7 support ending I figured it's time. I updated one of my computers to 10. I knew that you all had WMC running on 10 but haven't followed it much. So I started browsing to see how to get it working and get the file, but I found some posts that you need a much older version of 10 for cable card to work. The one computer I updated went to 1909. Will cable card never work again? Some technical reason the it won't work? sorry didn't see a specific thread on this, just some things here and there.

Re: will cable card ever work again?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 5:04 pm
by Burger23
You must use Windows 10-Build 1511-and use StopUpdates10 to stop automatic updates. I have been using this setup with 2 HDHomerun Prime tuners and Comcast cable cards.
See this thread https://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/v ... 21#p135021

Re: will cable card ever work again?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 7:13 pm
by adam1991
just reinstall Windows 7 and start all over.

Re: will cable card ever work again?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:00 pm
by hammerash
thanks, but I don't really think either of those are options. The reason I left 7 is because of concerns about security now that MS will not provide updates. seems like changing to 1511 and then trying to stop updates is also security problem? The computer that I put 10 on is not one that I really use for WMC, although it was up and running. It was going to be my test mule to see if (1.) I could upgrade to 10 free (check) and (2.) I could get WMC running (fail!) So my original question was if it would ever work on current builds? I guess something changed and I guess there isn't a work around for cable cards?

Re: will cable card ever work again?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:14 pm
by cwinfield
cable card works with silicondust hdhmerun app however not sure if they have protected channel recording sussed out.

Re: will cable card ever work again?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:21 pm
by hammerash
Yeh I think can watch DRM channels on silicon dust app, but don't think you can record DRM? DVR is pay service and I haven't tried yet. I also use plex and they have DVR/guide service now but there isn't any DRM. I don't have a lot of DRM channels but do watch and record them.

Re: will cable card ever work again?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:48 pm
by tonywagner
hammerash wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:00 pm
thanks, but I don't really think either of those are options. The reason I left 7 is because of concerns about security now that MS will not provide updates. seems like changing to 1511 and then trying to stop updates is also security problem?
What are you doing with your WMC computers that presents a security risk? Now that we have to use EPG123 for guide listings anyway, you don't even need them to connect to the internet if you don't want to.

I mean, WMC itself is basically unsupported software now (especially on Windows 10). It seems strange to be especially concerned about security but also trying to run WMC in 2020.

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 11:17 pm
by hammerash
Pretty simple explanation-My computers are not dedicated to WMC! One is my main desktop and I use it, my kids use it, and it runs WMC. It records shows in background while working on it, and sometimes I have window open with WMC and watch TV while working on computer. The other is a netbook that I sometimes record shows on and then take with me when travel and watch the recorded shows and use as normal laptop.
You know, doing pretty normal things that you do on a computer!

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 2:44 am
by adam1991
So build a dedicated WMC computer.

It's not like that's expensive, and the value is VERY high.

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 2:46 am
by hammerash
So before I used WMC, I used a hauppauge USB tuner on windows XP. Then when I got new Windows 7 Pro desktop, it had 64bit OS and there weren't 64 bit drivers for the Hauppauge tuner. I was able to create a XP virtual machine and ran the tuner. Is it possible to run win 7 as virtual machine on a win 10 computer and run WMC on the virtual machine? Don't know practical that would be. I ended up getting newer USB tuner because the original didn't have any IR blaster to change channels, which was fine at the time I bought it but at some point my cable company required a cable box for all but the basic network channels so I bought a newer USB tuner that worked with win 7 64 bit and had IR blaster. setting up the virtual machine was more a test. I was able to watch one tuner on win 7 and one tuner on xp virtual machine at the same time.

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 2:49 am
by hammerash
so how do you get guide date if not hooked up to the internet? Also, I use HD Home run prime. It is at other end of house near router and plugged into router. I do have a cable outlet near computer so I guess I could bring home run near computer and plug into cable outlet and direct connect to computer?

Re: will cable card ever work again?

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 4:57 pm
by GaryDZ
adam1991 wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 7:13 pm
just reinstall Windows 7 and start all over.

I just started looking into Windows 10 upgrade... since several sites said WMC was working on "Windows 10 version 1903 without any issues". I never thought of whether or not HD Homerun would work in WMC after the upgrade.

So WMC works, but not HD Homerun? If so, glad I found this post. I guess I will keep Windows 7. I read that you can Upgrade to 10 for free still, so I might back up the computer, install Windows 10 and then Restore it to 7 so I can move over to Windows 10 when/if they work out the HD Homerun issue.


Comment to confirm that I interpreted the info correct,

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:21 pm
by tonywagner
hammerash wrote:
Wed Jan 22, 2020 2:49 am
so how do you get guide date if not hooked up to the internet?
EPG123. It can run in a client-server model, so only the server has to connect to the outside internet, not the clients.

If you are running multiple WMC computers around your house, you'll probably want to do it as a client-server setup anyway, so you're not downloading the same data multiple times!

Re: will cable card ever work again?

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:26 pm
by tonywagner
GaryDZ wrote:
Wed Jan 22, 2020 4:57 pm
I just started looking into Windows 10 upgrade... since several sites said WMC was working on "Windows 10 version 1903 without any issues". I never thought of whether or not HD Homerun would work in WMC after the upgrade.

So WMC works, but not HD Homerun? If so, glad I found this post. I guess I will keep Windows 7. I read that you can Upgrade to 10 for free still, so I might back up the computer, install Windows 10 and then Restore it to 7 so I can move over to Windows 10 when/if they work out the HD Homerun issue.


Comment to confirm that I interpreted the info correct,
Just to be clear: HDHomerun devices work fine in Windows 10. Just not cablecard support in WMC on Windows 10 -- apparently you need to stay on Windows 10 Build 1511 for that, according to the second post of this thread.

I suspect the people saying WMC works fine on Windows 10 Build 1903 were not using cablecards.

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:52 pm
by tonywagner
hammerash wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 11:17 pm
Pretty simple explanation-My computers are not dedicated to WMC! One is my main desktop and I use it, my kids use it, and it runs WMC. It records shows in background while working on it, and sometimes I have window open with WMC and watch TV while working on computer. The other is a netbook that I sometimes record shows on and then take with me when travel and watch the recorded shows and use as normal laptop.
You know, doing pretty normal things that you do on a computer!
On a practical level, what exactly is your security concern?

In terms of day to day security, especially with kids using the computer, I think running something like Malwarebytes and using a firewall is a lot more important than monthly OS patches.

If you like using WMC with Cablecard protected content in this manner, I'd say just stick with Windows 7, be sure you're running Malwarebytes, and keep a backup of any important documents in the cloud (which you should be doing anyway).

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 10:30 pm
by Jacoats
I have also been struggling to get my HDHR Prime working with WMC10. This issue of course is WMC doesn't see the network tuners. I notice that in the HDHR set tool, if the signal type is set to digital cable instead of cable card, WMC10 does see the tuners, but the channels it finds are not the ones needed. They are like c.1 and c.2. This is the same wheter using the old set up program or the new one. Everything else seems to behave as it should.

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:15 am
by Jacoats
Update


I followed the instructions in that thread. Installed w10 1115 version and w10 mc with my HDHR prime & cable card. It worked ! Thank you


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:18 pm
by DavidinCT
hammerash wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:38 pm
I have been using WMC for over 5 years using a HD Home Run Prime and a cable card. I resisted the upgrade to windows 10 on all my computers because of WMC. But with 7 support ending I figured it's time. I updated one of my computers to 10. I knew that you all had WMC running on 10 but haven't followed it much. So I started browsing to see how to get it working and get the file, but I found some posts that you need a much older version of 10 for cable card to work. The one computer I updated went to 1909. Will cable card never work again? Some technical reason the it won't work? sorry didn't see a specific thread on this, just some things here and there.
Cablecards will never fully work with Windows 10 (on the newer builds) again. IF you have to use Windows 10 you need to go to a Very, VERY early version of Windows 10 and you would be safer to use Windows 7 or 8.1. The HDR model works with a back door but, will not work with premium channels that have DRM on them.

It was broken because Microsoft killed off the old DRM system (playready anyone?), this supported WMC, Zune and a bunch of other Music sites that had protected content on them. They all stopped working because of this. Microsoft went to a new DRM system that supports 4K and a lot of newer tech and abandoned the old one. The ONLY way to use them (if you have content) will be on Windows 7 or 8.1

As I said, the HDR works with a back door but, Ceton tuners could not even be found and will not work at all on newer builds Windows 10.

If you really want to be on WIndows 10 because of the support, maybe look at Windows 8.1, it will be supported to 2023.

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 11:03 am
by byronomo
hammerash wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 11:17 pm
Pretty simple explanation-My computers are not dedicated to WMC! One is my main desktop and I use it, my kids use it, and it runs WMC. It records shows in background while working on it, and sometimes I have window open with WMC and watch TV while working on computer. The other is a netbook that I sometimes record shows on and then take with me when travel and watch the recorded shows and use as normal laptop.
You know, doing pretty normal things that you do on a computer!
Hi....fyi. I had/have similar questions as yours and here is my VERY IMPERFECT solution. It will require you to have at least one Win7 HTPC somewhere on your network though.

I run WMC v8.84 on my Win10 (1909 build) machines without setting up Live TV. I am able to configure all other WMC functions as I wanted (MyMovies, home photo/video library, etc.) on those machines. The Win10 WMC computers are NOT dedicated HTPCs (like your case). I have about 8 other dedicated Win7 HTPCs on my network running WMC without issue (including Cable Card).
I installed the HDHR App on the 2 Win10 machines and it can be used if we NEED to watch LIVE TV on either of those machines (fairly easy to pin to the task bar and teach other family members how to use it). Otherwise, viewing recorded TV content from the Win7 machines seems to work fine on WMC on Win10 (I have not specifically tried protected content since most of what we record isn't flagged as such). Therefore I can watch recordings made on my other HTPCs on the Win10 machines at almost any time. To accomplish this, I can either use a method to dump all recordings onto a NAS/Server and point the WMC on Win10 Recorded TV Library to that location, OR I can point the Recorded TV Library to the Recorded TV Libraries on each of the 8 HTPCs individually (with proper credentials, of course). If you'll only have a single Win7 HTPC, the second method will probably be preferable. The single, dedicated Win7 HTPC should hopefully alleviate some/all of your security concerns about Win7.

I've only had this set up running for less than 24 hours now, so I'm not suggesting that it's trouble free. However, if you'd like any more particulars on my configuration, I'd be happy to help as much as I can (which would likely end up helping us both).

Re: Will CableCard ever work again in W10?

Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:49 pm
by handheldgames
FWIW... I was using w10 with WMC in the last version that supported cable cards. Even though I stopped all updates, over time, MS disabled win10 native apps and their app store. Even simple apps like calculator no longer worked. After the failure of a samsung ssd, I gave up on w10 and did not restore my backup.

I reinstalled windows 8.1 and attempted to install the v14 WMC install from the community. While I could get it into a working state, getting playready drm fully functional for cable cards was problematic and required WMC to be maximized /reduced to a window to get the cable card going. There are a lot of approaches to get around this and none of them worked. After too many hours wasted.. I purchased this specific upgrade from ebay[/url] that adds WMC to win 8.1

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Microsoft-Wind ... 2749.l2649

While an updated version of Win 8.1 gets an error when attempting to add features , I was able to get around this by resetting my Win 8.1 installation using a built in windows feature. After the reset, I was able to install WMC and after a long install that took forever without feedback and required patience.

With that said, I have a fully functional version of win 8.1 WMC that works without issue on a 2012 mac pro with 48gb of RAM.

Some caveats... AMD stopped supporting win 8.1 years ago, supporting up to the RX400 series of GPU. While 15.7.2 is the last official release GPU's idle temps it has temp and buffer issues. Installing the win 7 x64 version 17.11.2 works and resolved my issues. In my case, I'm using a R9 nano I picked up on Ebat for under $150 shipped.

Although I don't have a Win10 WMC cablecard setup,win 8.1 has 3 more years of updates which is better that win 7 currently offers.