Guide Data Running Out - Spring 2016 DST

Global guide related discussion. All Windows versions.
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garyan2

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Re: Guide Data Running Out - Spring 2016 DST

#61

Post by garyan2 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:09 am

Skybolt wrote:Nope, just the opposite. I tried to get the epg123 guide working and the only thing I was able to do was order a new Tivo setup. Good luck guys on this guide thing I'm throwing in the towel after many many years with WMC.

A word of caution when setting up the epg123, it doesn't work on every setup and can wipe you to the point where you must re-install WMC to get it working. Others may say differently, but before you say - he doesn't understand what he's doing, read my bio. Good luck with this one, it looks like a lot of work went into this and should be real nice for some.
This is information that would be helpful in the further development of epg123, which upon reading your bio you should be well aware of. It's always good to know what works, but it is critical to know what doesn't. That's the only way to truly understand how something works and improve upon it. So if you could provide some details on your experience that would be helpful ... I'll try to keep up.

You can post the information in the EPG123 forum (there is a Bug Reports thread already open), start your own thread, or message me the details. If it happened to you, then it will probably happen to someone else. The last thing I want to do is damage someone's system.

A quick question though, were you running Vista? I realized over the weekend that I hadn't specified anywhere that this will only work with Win7 and above. I haven't researched the method to import a guide in Vista so don't know if it can be done. If you tried to use epg123 on a Vista machine, it will undoubtably fail in a spectacular way I believe.
- Gary
Keeping WMC alive beyond January 2020. http://epg123.garyan2.net

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Crash2009

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#62

Post by Crash2009 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:33 am

Octavean wrote:I feel like I have to get something done by tomorrow. I think it unwise to wait longer then that.
In July 2015 During the original Rovi Fiasco, I waited until there was 8 hours left in the Zap2it EPG. I had no success until about an hour after the deadline. It was looking pretty bleak all day, nothing worked. I still don't know if it was one of the suggestions I tried or if it was just simply "My turn to get a plate of ROVI".

The point is don't break it until you have to.

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#63

Post by bob_p » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:52 am

Officially, Microsoft could claim that support for Windows Media Center ended in January this year, with the end of "maintstream support" for Windows 7, the last operating release containing WMC. While Microsoft did sell licenses for WMC as an app added onto Windows 8 and 8.1, it's not clear support for those apps is included in Windows 8 "mainstream support", which is supposed to expire in January 2018.

Similarly the fate of the Xbox 360 extender software is also very unclear. Microsoft is already ramping down support for Xbox 360.

So far, Microsoft hasn't made any public statement (as far as I can tell) about their plans for WMC support. And without that, it's very possible that this could be the end of Microsoft's support for the WMC program guide service. The data in the current guide not only ends on March 19 - it is missing a lot of detail, many first run episodes have no descriptions - and some of the programs are just wrong (like some of the presidential debates in the last week).

Unfortunately, for those of us using cablecards for DRM, there isn't a viable replacement for WMC today. SD's DVR software is still early, and even when it's release is probably going to fall too short of a WMC replacement to be acceptable (no program guide grid...).

EPG123 might be a short term solution - but those of us with Xbox 360 extenders can't have confidence they will continue working, so even if we can workaround the loss of the Rovi guide service, we could still find our "whole home DVR" environment will stop working unexpectedly one day.

Has anyone checked with SD or Ceton? Surely they still have some contacts inside Microsoft - since this affects their customers. If consumers can't reach Microsoft through the front door, hopefully Microsoft's past hardware partners could go through the side door and get an answer...

For me, the scenario will probably go something like this... Our WMC box has program guide through 5:25AM on Friday morning. In an emergency, we can manually set recordings for a few days - using channel and time, bypassing the program guide completely. If necessary, we could theoretically set up manual rules for recording all of our series, which should work as long as programs don't change time - though we'll end up with extra recordings when repeats are shown. While not ideal, this would buy us some time to find a longer term solution.

We also have a Comcast X1 DVR (we get it free with out cable package). And while we don't have the extra STBs to use it in a "whole home DVR" configuration, we could shift some recording over the X1 DVR, at least to buy us more time to find a better solution.

TiVo is tempting, though I'd prefer to hold out until they get a 6 tuner version of the Bolt. We probably need more than 4 tuners (since there are times when we are recording or watching 4 programs at a time) - and I really don't want to pay an annual subscription ($150 per year) and Comcast cablecard fee ($100 per year) for an extra Bolt - just to get more than 4 tuners.

Before making any hardware purchase, I will probably make a stab at getting EPG123 to work. Since we can keep our WMC box running for a while with manual recordings, I'll probably set up a temporary system with WMC running - and do a test install of EPG123 on that system first. And only if I have confidence that EPG123 is stable, then update the production WMC box to EPG123.

Though, like has happened in the past, it's also possible WMC will miraculously starting working again (at least this time), and we'll buy at least another 6 months of WMC usage until the next daylight savings switch...

Though even if we do get this working again this time - at some point, WMC will likely stop working - without any real warning. And, I'm not sure I really want to be in a position where I have to make a changeover - at a time that may not be very convenient for us...

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#64

Post by philipt95148 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 5:22 am

How about an OTA card?
Can I put an OTA card in the slot of the Ceton and hook that up to an HD OTA antenna?
What guide will I have wit that?
Thanks

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davidhp

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#65

Post by davidhp » Tue Mar 15, 2016 6:13 am

I have Win TV software that came with my external Hauppauget TV Tuner, while it doesn't have a guide (EPG), I can program recording shows like on an old VCR and can program so it will record the same channel at the same day of the week and time for recording a series. It is not as convenient as WMC but it will do in a pinch I guess. I just bought a new computer after Windows 10 came out and made sure I got one with Windows 8.1 so I could keep WMC. I wish Microsoft would realize that their are still quite a few customers who want to use WMC and at least sell the rights to a company willing to keep it going for us for a nominal fee.

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#66

Post by Space » Tue Mar 15, 2016 7:20 am

davidhp wrote:I have Win TV software that came with my external Hauppauget TV Tuner, while it doesn't have a guide (EPG), I can program recording shows like on an old VCR and can program so it will record the same channel at the same day of the week and time for recording a series. It is not as convenient as WMC but it will do in a pinch I guess. I just bought a new computer after Windows 10 came out and made sure I got one with Windows 8.1 so I could keep WMC. I wish Microsoft would realize that their are still quite a few customers who want to use WMC and at least sell the rights to a company willing to keep it going for us for a nominal fee.
You can do the same type of recording with WMC if the guide should run out. recorded tv -> +add recording -> Channel and Time

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#67

Post by adam1991 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 8:21 am

So here it is Tuesday morning in my neck of the woods, and.....nothing. No joy.

XXXXXXXX

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#68

Post by XXXXXXXX » Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:55 am

Tuesday 3am here in phoenix... no update.. anyone having any luck? If we run out of hope here.. does anyone have a dvr solution for PC?

Thanks X

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#69

Post by maureeng61 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 10:39 am

I just read a post on Windows 7 Microsoft Community that the guide will be fixed today or tomorrow. Posted by Barb Bowman. http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/wind ... 07?page=31

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#70

Post by Skybolt » Tue Mar 15, 2016 10:45 am

rkulagow wrote:I think you need to be fair to @garyan2; his software is what, less than a month old? And for a lot of people, it works better than what they're getting from Rovi / Microsoft. ...
I think you need to re-read my post, I didn't bash anyone or any software. I merely pointed out it rendered my system useless for livetv, then complemented his work.

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#71

Post by Skybolt » Tue Mar 15, 2016 11:23 am

garyan2 wrote:... This is information that would be helpful in the further development of epg123, which upon reading your bio you should be well aware of. It's always good to know what works, but it is critical to know what doesn't. That's the only way to truly understand how something works and improve upon it. So if you could provide some details on your experience that would be helpful ... I'll try to keep up.

You can post the information in the EPG123 forum (there is a Bug Reports thread already open), start your own thread, or message me the details. If it happened to you, then it will probably happen to someone else. The last thing I want to do is damage someone's system.

A quick question though, were you running Vista? I realized over the weekend that I hadn't specified anywhere that this will only work with Win7 and above. I haven't researched the method to import a guide in Vista so don't know if it can be done. If you tried to use epg123 on a Vista machine, it will undoubtably fail in a spectacular way I believe.
I posted this info in another tread: MY thread

If I can help out by testing anything please ask and I'll do my best.
Thanks,
Skybolt

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#72

Post by Tivo2WMC » Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:18 pm

Greetings. Over the years whenever I run into little issues with WMC, upon many Google searches the solutions to those issues were almost always found here. The last time I landed here was when I changed processor and killed DRM, was somewhat in a panic because this was the last of my Windows 8.1 WMC license that I can't even buy any more. I ended up here yesterday with yet another search on the guide not updating. Time to register and give my thanks :)

I have no less than 6 computers of various kinds, with two being dedicated 24/7, setup to run WMC. One of them is on a laptop which hadn't been in use for two months. I let it update and somewhat interestingly it brought the guide data to 3/19/2016. I was expecting it to flat out not update at all. This will be my testbed to try EPG123. WMC has been reliable and trouble free for the past 5-6 years, and I wish I could run it forever. But with Microsoft trying to kill it off, it's the perfect opportunity for me to get in there and try to extend its life.

I may be pointing out the obvious here, but any time before I make any changes, I always image the boot drive so that I can experiment without worries. Had long been a habit of mine. Macrium works beautifully and is free.

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#73

Post by webminster » Tue Mar 15, 2016 1:26 pm

No luck here in 80528 this morning, manual guide update just threw a "guide can't be downloaded" dialog. Here's hoping the tomorrow rumor has teeth.
-Alan

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#74

Post by Octavean » Tue Mar 15, 2016 2:29 pm

maureeng61 wrote:I just read a post on Windows 7 Microsoft Community that the guide will be fixed today or tomorrow. Posted by Barb Bowman. http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/wind ... 07?page=31
Fingers crossed but that does look promising. So some time today or tomorrow really does seem like a ray of hope or the obligatory bone has been thrown. I'll take it :)

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#75

Post by Bee_Dee_3_Dee » Tue Mar 15, 2016 2:42 pm

Octavean wrote:
maureeng61 wrote:I just read a post on Windows 7 Microsoft Community that the guide will be fixed today or tomorrow. Posted by Barb Bowman. http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/wind ... 07?page=31
Fingers crossed but that does look promising. So some time today or tomorrow really does seem like a ray of hope or the obligatory bone has been thrown. I'll take it :)
i feel trapped... shipwrecked... don't know what to do...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPN3Fv2aJhE :D

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#76

Post by Space » Tue Mar 15, 2016 2:58 pm

maureeng61 wrote:I just read a post on Windows 7 Microsoft Community that the guide will be fixed today or tomorrow. Posted by Barb Bowman. http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/wind ... 07?page=31
This is good news, Barb's info has always been good in the past.

Note that even though you may have guide data until Thursday/Friday, that data is 8 days old and may be inaccurate, so if you have any important shows you don't want to miss, it is a good idea to check the next couple days and make sure WMC is set to record everything you want (setting favorites on zap2it and displaying the calendar is how I have found it is most easy to create a list of upcoming NEW shows that I want to record).

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#77

Post by adam1991 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:02 pm

agreed, I'll take it. I'll take what I can get right now.

But as I use WMC only as a whole house DVR for OTA TV, and as I have Roku on every TV for streaming, I'm going to buy a Tablo for DVR duties. Tablo+USB hard drive (5TB!)+lifetime guide is under US$500, and that includes all the streaming to any device you may want--including out of your home. And they stream using a Roku channel (among other options), so TV watching is still TV watching--not tablet- or computer-watching. That's important to me. I still sit and watch TV with the family.

Or I might just go the "safe" route and spend more money with Tivo, but I doubt it. I dunno.

I remember 6 or 7 years ago; I had three ReplayTV in the house, and life was great, but I knew that it couldn't last. I knew that analog TV was dying. So I started poking around, and I saw that Ceton was making a cableCARD tuner that would work with WMC. I spent a long time wathing that develop, and as coincidence would have it Ceton released the InfiniTV4 PCIe just as I was getting the warning letter from my cableco that digital was coming. That was five years ago.

I found it online at one of the two retailers that had it, and paid $433 shipped for that thing. And I was happy about it! (Get off my lawn.) Mac guy that I am, I still managed to spec a nice HTPC for DVR use; by another happy accident I chose the i3 that drives HDMI without any trouble.

And right about now, mid-March, is the fifth anniversary of my 7MC HTPC build and turning it on for the family.

But, just like with analog TV, I can see the writing on the wall. So I'm preparing for the jump before everything falls apart. This guide thing going down to two days is a sure sign that next time, the odds are too much for me that it'll just fall apart. EPG123 seems nice, but I'm not in the mood to wrap bandages and tourniquets on the dying piece.

And I know that, just like with the ReplayTV forum on AVS, five years from now TGB will still be around with those handful of diehards who refuse to acknowledge defeat, keeping WMC7 going despite MS's best efforts to make them give up.

I find it ironic, the parallels with ReplayTV and the guide issue. Those who have paid attention over the last few years know what I'm talking about.

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#78

Post by IownFIVEechos » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:06 pm

I am much more concerned with the mpeg4 format issue then the guide issue. No one has an answer for the mpeg4 issue :(
While we still have Barb's attention someone should ask her about the extender mpeg4 issue!

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#79

Post by davidhp » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:10 pm

Barb has always come through for us in connecting with MS and getting a commitment from them to fix these EPG problems, so I am very hopeful that it will be working on 3/16.

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#80

Post by davidhp » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:14 pm

Space wrote:
davidhp wrote:I have Win TV software that came with my external Hauppauget TV Tuner, while it doesn't have a guide (EPG), I can program recording shows like on an old VCR and can program so it will record the same channel at the same day of the week and time for recording a series. It is not as convenient as WMC but it will do in a pinch I guess. I just bought a new computer after Windows 10 came out and made sure I got one with Windows 8.1 so I could keep WMC. I wish Microsoft would realize that their are still quite a few customers who want to use WMC and at least sell the rights to a company willing to keep it going for us for a nominal fee.
You can do the same type of recording with WMC if the guide should run out. recorded tv -> +add recording -> Channel and Time
I do that now with WMC for the couple of stations that ROVI doesn't recognize in my channel line up, but I don't know how to make it a re-occurring weekly recording when manually setting a recording in WMC.

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