WMC 7 and HDR10 movies/videos

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DavidinCT

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WMC 7 and HDR10 movies/videos

#1

Post by DavidinCT » Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:31 pm

Hey all,

I searched around but, didn't find anything. I have not run into this before so I figured someone else must of. I finally got a new TV, and it supports all the good features, HDR, Dolby Vision etc. YEA ! My Xbox one X looks epic on it.

So I ripped a 4K blu-ray with HDR to my built in movie library. I play the movie, No HDR logo (showing that it switched to HDR), and the movie looks almost black and white. A sign I have seen by playing HDR content on a Non-HDR TV.

The Video card is a GTX1050ti, and I have confirmed the video card does support it, I am running HDMI with a good cable and the AVR supports HDMI 2.0b, so it's nothing in my path that would break it.

Is this a Windows 10 only thing (As I search for HDR and Windows 7, all I get is Windows 10 things)? Or is there a way to enable it on 7, or even 8.1 (time to move to 8.1 ?)?
-Dave
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#2

Post by aquadextrous » Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:00 pm

Hey,
I'm pretty sure that HDR suport native to windows was only introduced with 10. And even then, it's not very good. In my experience HDR just makes text blurry, lighter and unreadable at high res with low scaling (I like everything small) so i never have it enabled.
If you're looking to play the files back through WMC then it doesn't work anyway. I can switch the Windows Desktop HDR mode on and my TV will display that mode, as soon as i launch WMC it goes back to normal mode. I guess that programs and apps have to support it and, as expected, WMC doesn't.

Hope this info helps :)

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#3

Post by jachin99 » Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:19 pm

You would have to use an external player for those file types. Newer versions of LAV will pass HDR Metadata to the renderer but WMC's renderer can't be changed, and wont display HDR I believe.

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#4

Post by DavidinCT » Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:31 pm

Sorry, dup post....
Last edited by DavidinCT on Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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DavidinCT

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#5

Post by DavidinCT » Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:37 pm

aquadextrous wrote:
Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:00 pm
Hey,
I'm pretty sure that HDR suport native to windows was only introduced with 10. And even then, it's not very good. In my experience HDR just makes text blurry, lighter and unreadable at high res with low scaling (I like everything small) so i never have it enabled.
If you're looking to play the files back through WMC then it doesn't work anyway. I can switch the Windows Desktop HDR mode on and my TV will display that mode, as soon as i launch WMC it goes back to normal mode. I guess that programs and apps have to support it and, as expected, WMC doesn't.

Hope this info helps :)
Thanks. Windows 10 changed playready for HDR and DRM, it's what broke cablecards in WMC. According to NVIDIA, it does work under Windows 7, just any DRM'd sources that USE Playready 3.0 will not work under Windows 7.

I am not worried as much about WMC here, it's the Media player, I believe it still uses Media Player. When I movie/video starts with HDR, WMC is not really active.

This is how I understand it from the Beta test days on Windows 7 WMC... and I was talking to one of the members on the eHome team about this. It's why if you install Windows 7 clean, DIVX files will not play at all in WMC...and will not play in Media Player but, once you install a codec...the plays in both..

So it "SHOULD" work...

jachin99 wrote:
Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:19 pm
You would have to use an external player for those file types. Newer versions of LAV will pass HDR Metadata to the renderer but WMC's renderer can't be changed, and wont display HDR I believe.
I use LAV codecs with Shark007.... Interesting, I have not updated it in a while, maybe it's time to TRY it. Just to TRY...

As I still use the built in Movie Library, I didn't want to change now. I know when I had 3-D movies, it treated it fine and the TV switched to 3-D mode (my last TV supported 3-D, this one does not). I don't want a different library for different types of movies.

Am I screwed because I want every movie in one library ?
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#6

Post by Paul Anderegg » Sat Aug 31, 2019 8:02 am

Best to stay OUT of WMC for anything above 1080p SDR...I use VLC and Media Center Classic for most non recorded TV stuff...you can add MadVR to your Windows 7 system which has a toggle for HDR10 metadata trigger, so your TV will auto switch to HDR10 on it's own and you can throw HDR files from those non WMC players, assuming you get one that is HDR compatible.

If you think HDR on Windows 10 is fuzzy, it's not, it is that you are using HDR mode for the desktop, which is not what HDR is made for. To get 10 bit color, over HDMI 2.0, you can't use RGB, so you end up loosing all the stuff that makes text look sharp, but not loosing anything for moving video.

Paul

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#7

Post by DavidinCT » Sun Oct 06, 2019 3:19 pm

Paul Anderegg wrote:
Sat Aug 31, 2019 8:02 am
Best to stay OUT of WMC for anything above 1080p SDR...I use VLC and Media Center Classic for most non recorded TV stuff...you can add MadVR to your Windows 7 system which has a toggle for HDR10 metadata trigger, so your TV will auto switch to HDR10 on it's own and you can throw HDR files from those non WMC players, assuming you get one that is HDR compatible.

If you think HDR on Windows 10 is fuzzy, it's not, it is that you are using HDR mode for the desktop, which is not what HDR is made for. To get 10 bit color, over HDMI 2.0, you can't use RGB, so you end up loosing all the stuff that makes text look sharp, but not loosing anything for moving video.

Paul
Sorry, missed this this reply. Still using WMC's built in Movie Library. Needing to EXIT WMC to play a movie is not an acceptable work-around. I need a solution that I can select the movie, and maybe if I have to run a script to kick off a 3rd party player to play the movie, allowing remote controls and maybe even exit the movie when the Green button is pressed.

My options for Windows Media Center is Windows 7 or 8.1. Going to a 1607 version of Windows 10 (where cablecards are still supported) does not give me any EXTRA options to play HDR content. I would be just as good running Windows 8.1 (pretty much the same at that point)

Still looking for an option here. Still on my setup, Running high bit rate 4K movies give a flawless picture. It's just the HDR based content I have a problem with...and it's so disappointing...

Any other thoughts or work-arounds here that will be acceptable for my setup, even a 3rd party movie library that works as good as the built in movie library and will allow pass through of HD audio (7.1 atmos or DTSX, etc) with out screwing with the picture too much and show HDR correct.

My TV works fine with HDR content from other sources, Even video games...
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#8

Post by jachin99 » Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:37 pm

I think if I were to try this, I would start by creating some kind of shortcut for a hdr file that tells WMC to use directx in a way that is similar to pdvd 15. WMC can only use dx9 if I remember correctly. Madvr is still dx9 compatible and maybe some kind of combination of dx9, madvr, and a properly written shortcut would let WMC bypass its own renderer and display dx content. You would have to really know what your doing though, especially if you try to replace the WMC video renderer with a new one.

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#9

Post by DavidinCT » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:10 pm

jachin99 wrote:
Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:37 pm
I think if I were to try this, I would start by creating some kind of shortcut for a hdr file that tells WMC to use directx in a way that is similar to pdvd 15. WMC can only use dx9 if I remember correctly. Madvr is still dx9 compatible and maybe some kind of combination of dx9, madvr, and a properly written shortcut would let WMC bypass its own renderer and display dx content. You would have to really know what your doing though, especially if you try to replace the WMC video renderer with a new one.
Well if it's an app... I'll rename the files from mkv to hdr... and associate file.hdr with another player. Wonder if that would work. I'll have to look how ReLaunch it works MAYBE there is a way to put a script to show up as a movie (in the factory movie library), once clicked on PLAY, it would close WMC and run the movie in a 3rd party player..

Thoughts ?
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#10

Post by jachin99 » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:43 pm

That might work. If not you can try mikinhos open with, or that add-on that sets mpchc as an external player for the movie library.

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#11

Post by DavidinCT » Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:54 pm

jachin99 wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:43 pm
That might work. If not you can try mikinhos open with, or that add-on that sets mpchc as an external player for the movie library.
Do you have a copy of mikinhos open with ? I looked I don't have a copy...

So, for a trial.... What standalone player will play HDR10 movies (even high bitrate 4K with HD audio), and honor all audio formats via bitstream ?
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#12

Post by jachin99 » Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:48 pm

Here is a copy of open with https://drive.google.com/open?id=1g_Qzi ... DJSsRCtOqY

I would start with MPC-HC beause I think your remote will still work, even with WMC minimized.

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#13

Post by DavidinCT » Tue Oct 08, 2019 2:18 pm

jachin99 wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:48 pm
Here is a copy of open with https://drive.google.com/open?id=1g_Qzi ... DJSsRCtOqY

I would start with MPC-HC beause I think your remote will still work, even with WMC minimized.
Thanks !

WMC cant be running when it's working. Media Center requires exclusive audio modes. So bitstreaming will not work with a 3rd party player (ran into this with WINDVD and other blu-ray plaing software).

I'll check it out, as I need to learn how this app works...
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#14

Post by glorp » Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:46 am

Look at MyMovies. Runs as an extension of WMC in Win7/8 to provide an integrated browser interface for launching movies. A bit dated gui but can launch MPC as an external player so madVR with its HDR passthru are available. It handles WMC minimization on launch and restore after so there's no "exit to launch" needed.

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#15

Post by DavidinCT » Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:38 pm

glorp wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:46 am
Look at MyMovies. Runs as an extension of WMC in Win7/8 to provide an integrated browser interface for launching movies. A bit dated gui but can launch MPC as an external player so madVR with its HDR passthru are available. It handles WMC minimization on launch and restore after so there's no "exit to launch" needed.
Thanks for the advice. I will NEVER touch MyMovies. I went though a trial of it, with my under 200 movies (at the time) and it was a nightmare. Even on a fairly good spec'ed machine it would not run good and it would cause problems if UAC was enabled. I have over 500 now and would not even think about that one.

Here is my experience with MyMovies and why I would not even look at this product...

https://www.mymovies.dk/forum.aspx?g=posts&t=40430

I did give it a valid shot, as for Movie management goes, MyMovies is not anything I would ever try again..

and here is when I was looking for a Movie management replacement...

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=8702
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#16

Post by DavidinCT » Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:21 pm

First test today.... Installed MPC-HC and MadVR, Changed the default Directshow decoder in MPC-HC to MadVR, and set HD audio to my AVR (it picked up EDID from HDMI). Played a HDR10 movie in MPC-HC... The movie played back in HDR (TV showed HDR was enabled) and my AVR got Atmos sound !

Looks like "Open With" SHOULD do what I need....will test a little later tonight..
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#17

Post by DavidinCT » Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:35 am

Tried another option with no luck....sigh...Sounded like it would do EXACTLY what I needed, here is my issue...

viewtopic.php?p=133385#p133385

and Open with I have no idea on how it works... if anyone knows, enlighten me please ? :)
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#18

Post by SENIORA » Sat Oct 19, 2019 10:11 am

Paul Anderegg wrote:
Sat Aug 31, 2019 8:02 am
Best to stay OUT of WMC for anything above 1080p SDR...I use VLC and Media Center Classic for most non recorded TV stuff...you can add MadVR to your Windows 7 system which has a toggle for HDR10 metadata trigger, so your TV will auto switch to HDR10 on it's own and you can throw HDR files from those non WMC players, assuming you get one that is HDR compatible.

If you think HDR on Windows 10 is fuzzy, it's not, it is that you are using HDR mode for the desktop, which is not what HDR is made for. To get 10 bit color, over HDMI 2.0, you can't use RGB, so you end up loosing all the stuff that makes text look sharp, but not loosing anything for moving video.

Paul
So I ripped a 4K blu-ray with HDR to my built in movie library. I play the movie, No HDR logo (showing that it switched to HDR), and the movie looks almost black and white. A sign I have seen by playing HDR content on a Non-HDR TV.

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