EPG123 v1.14 Epic Fail

[garyan2]

@ViperJohn: Just a heads up, next version will change the Step 1 removal of ehome folder to simply empty the contents of the folder instead of deleting it. This will allow you to use Step 1 with SimLinks ... which I think is a pretty cool idea to do that.

So to sum up your problems with v1.1.4 ... changing from a 1-step process to a 2-step process caused your existing shortcut to only do "half" of the guide update... the first half being the creation of the mxf file and the second half the mxf file import into the WMC database. The first step is considered the "server" component while the second step is considered the "client" component. For a machine that functions as both server and client, both commands have to be executed.

epg123.exe -update
epg123Client.exe -i epg123.mxf

[IT Troll]

If only this was written down somewhere...

Two things to watch out for with folder redirection:

Symbolic Links and Juctions behave differently in certain scenarios; particularly if UNC paths are used rather than traditional file paths.

The O/S still knows about the redirection. If you use Windows own system imaging it will include all referenced drives in the image. So if you have redirected a folder to D: and then take an image of C:, it will automatically include D: in the image in order to preserve the link. Third party imaging may workaround this by effectively breaking the link.

[ViperJohn]

That is correct.

I'm just going to go ahead and do a facepalm ...if I understand correctly now, when you were trying to perform updates with v1.1.4, you were using a shortcut and not using the GUI nor the Task?

That would be a negative. I was using the Save and Execute button in EPG123.exe GUI most of the time. I did use an "-update" shortcut as a quick way to see what was happening (that was when the light didn't go on to run the command from a Command Prompt).

I have figured out various issues and side tracks that smacked me onto tangents. The original issue was I didn't delete 1.0.2's task and create 1.1.4's multi-task. Thats when I was getting D/L from SD and the save to disk of the Epg123.mxf file but no import to WMC. After your first reply I realized my error on the tasks and deleted then recreated them .. and still got squat. What I also did right at that point was to decide to go completely fresh on the EPG123 install. I deleted the Epg123.cfg and Epg123.mxf so they would be recreated from scratch ... and thats when the brown stuff really hit the fan. It didn't help that I was exhausted and brain faded now as well.

I ran EPG123.exe and created the tasks, check boxed my channels, left auto-match unchecked (I would manual match as always) hit Save then Save and Execute .. and got bupkiss. When the new EPG123.cfg was generated NO "include" lines (like say <IncludedLineup>USA-OTA-92704</IncludedLineup>) were to be found anywhere in the config file. Seems that without specific "include" line(s) EPG123 defaults to exclude D/Ling everything. Forgive me but this seem backwards to me as default "include everything except whats excluded" would be fail safe...albeit slower. I'm sure there is a valid reason why it is the way it is though.

Anyway I didn't catch the red indicator. Hell I can't say have never even noticed it before, red or green, or that it was a include_exclude selector. So now I was really getting nothing but I actually didn't realize that at this point. My brain had shut down and I wasn't grasping the info in the command window anymore. I then tried auto-match. Ya know what happens when ya auto-match with everything excluded ... EPG123 unchecks all the channels you had selected in WMC and when ya finally realize that it's a WTF, how did that happen, head scratch moment!!! Oh man are we having fun now or what ..... TILT.

So after some sleep and running -update at a command prompt I was able to see that I was no longer getting anything from SD. I looked in the log and spotted the "exclude" in the listing, put 2+2 together and it took all of 10 minutes to sort, fix it and understand the new task function (which you confirmed). The only thing left now is write a Cmd script to call from a new Update and Import shortcut

Viper

[IT Troll]

The upgrade process from pre v1.1 releases has been covered many times before in this forum. There was also a lot of discussion prior to the release about the architecture changes. This has now dropped of the first page because we are a few versions on now.

http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... 99&t=10650

So it seems you have paid the price of being a late adopter by having a painful upgrade. However, if you had followed the install guide to the letter it would have worked first time.

[ViperJohn]

The upgrade process from pre v1.1 releases has been covered many times before in this forum. There was also a lot of discussion prior to the release about the architecture changes. This has now dropped of the first page because we are a few versions on now.

http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... 99&t=10650

So it seems you have paid the price of being a late adopter by having a painful upgrade. However, if you had followed the install guide to the letter it would have worked first time.

Gees Louise give it rest. Painful ... no ... frustrating ... yes but no danger either as this was on a new test only system for exactly this reason.

You also have the luxury of knowing EXACTLY where to look for that info in your link.. This is what I saw WHEN I WENT LOOKING:
http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/viewforum.php?f=99:

You're link above should be stickied at the very top of the page that my link points to. Important info like this change should be drop dead no brainer (STICKY) simple to spot. Red type in the sticky wouldn't hurt either.

Yes and i've upgraded EPG123 several times over several versions by simply copying the new executables into the EPG123 folder. That was the tried, true, known and promoted upgrade method. I had no reason to think or suspect the GUIDE, and the upgrade method, had changed that much from the previous times I read it with earlier versions. Heck in the first versions we didn't even have a guide. We had some rather crude instructions in TheGreenButton forums. I suspect Garyan2 knows exactly what I am talking about. Awh the good old days!!!

[IT Troll]

You also have the luxury of knowing EXACTLY where to look for that info in your link.. This is what I saw WHEN I WENT LOOKING:
http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/viewforum.php?f=99:

You're link above should be stickied at the very top of the page that my link points to. Important info like this change should be drop dead no brainer (STICKY) simple to spot. Red type in the sticky wouldn't hurt either.

Not really, I just typed "upgrade" into the search box.

I do agree that a stickied FAQ would be useful for people who don't visit the forum so often.

I am sure Gary would prefer to find posts thanking him for creating EPG123 and the very patient support he gives, rather than simply "EPG123 Epic Fail". Great way to introduce yourself to the forum.

[garyan2]

That would be a negative. ...

Wow, it all makes since now. I don't think any of that could have been planned any better than what actually happened to draw this out.

Note on the 'INCLUDE' and 'EXCLUDE' lineup button. This was added a long time ago to add the capability to not cross contaminate lineups for any given HTPC. Examples would be a single house household with multiple HTPCs but with different tuner types and lineups. One could be Cable, another could be Satellite with OTA. Since a user only has 1 account with SD, they would have to have subscribed to 3 lineups to cover the house. The HTPC with Cable would 'EXCLUDE' the Satellite and OTA lineups in the update and everything would work fine with automatch and autoadd. Same would be true for the other HTPC and excluding the Cable lineup.

The behavior is as such, if you add a lineup in the GUI, it is automatically included (with no channels selected). If the lineup is already a part of the account when epg123 is run with no configuration file (new), the lineup is automatically excluded. This is really meant to make sure that the downloaded stations are truly what the user intended. It is easy to recognize and recover from 0 station downloads from excluding a lineup than it is to recognize the guide listings for some/all channels are not from the correct lineup. The default exclude also protects you ... you could add a different lineup in say emby or MythTV which would totally screw up your WMC setup if it was automatically included. This way, anytime you change you selected lineups with Schedules Direct, you don't have to reconfigure all your WMC installs.

[garyan2]

@IT Troll & ViperJohn: You guys are why I drink!

I am sure Gary would prefer to find posts thanking him for creating EPG123 and the very patient support he gives...

There is some truth to that and there are plenty of example posts that are only a few comments because the problem was something simple. I think there are only a couple posts that actually identify a flaw in the program ... most of it is just not understanding how EPG123 and/or WMC works.

I certainly recognize I can't make people read and understand everything about EPG123. I can just do my best in documenting what I can in the guide and on the website (which is lacking in that area). A FAQ would be greatly beneficial but I just haven't had the time to devote to it. I do have a video walk-through on the site though which should help some. I try to cover all the gotchas there and any alternate/advanced methods.

Basically, I do what I can and don't sweat the moments when I'm not perfectly clear, or cover all possible scenarios. For the transition to 1.1.x, I made a poor choice in the beginning of EPG123 with the unique IDs for the channels. I recognized it, corrected it, and developed a method to make the transition successful. This was the first and only "breaking" change in epg123's nearly 16-month history and it was only a true "breaking" change for a small population. If automatch was used, or was even possible to use, then the transition utility wouldn't actually be needed. Only for those users that can't use the automatch feature would the utility be needed.

Anywho ... you guys need to make up. This was certainly an interesting "perfect storm" and "comedy of errors" kind of scenario and we all just simply got off on the wrong foot. Some assumptions were made that just weren't true so everyone (including me) just raise your hand, shake your head, say "Yup, that was me", own it, and move on. I'll tip a pint to the both of you tonight. Plus, you guys are pretty close to experts on how this works and can help out on the boards even more!

Cheers!

[ViperJohn]

@IT Troll & ViperJohn: You guys are why I drink!

Cheers!

FYI to All ... My topic "EPG123 v1.14 Epic Fail" was refering to *** ME *** not Gary or EPG123!!!

Nothing really for Troll and I to make up for. Ours are just the inevitable differences that occur when you put a stoic, by the book, by the numbers Brit in the same room with the now much looser descendants of those same Brits that relocated to the CORRECT side of the Big Pond 500 years ago.

I now understand why Include / Exclude works the way it does but wow that is a perfect example of how the best intentioned, best layed code will still find a way to bite somebody in the butt. For me that was quicksand trap that I fell in over my head without even knowing it at the time.

I have a quick and dirty suggestion that may cure all of this. How about including a short "IMPORTANT NEW INSTALL or UPGRADE INFO ReadMe" file in the EPG123 download. This would go in the same folder as the !!! 13 Page !!! PDF manual and executables. Crucial bullet point info right in front of you with no searching anywhere for it.

All it has to say is:

***************************************

(1) If this is a new EPG123 install and you have an existing channel lineup(s) configured at Schedules Direct BE SURE to Include your desired channel lineup during initial setup - Click the Red Button.

Now if I understand correctly if the button is green that would
mean the EPG123.cfg exists and a lineup is already included
but just in case we have item (2) below.


(2) If this is a EPG123 upgrade check to make sure your desired channel lineup is included - Click the Green Button


(3) *** IMPORTANT *** When upgrading ALWAYS delete the existing tasks and recreate the tasks with the new version.

There is no need for any confusing version mention here. Just do it on every
upgrade, needed or not, and you're future proofed for further change later.


I think the above is pretty close to the wording needed. You can edit out the comments and use as-is if you agree.

A ReadMe like this I (and anyone with a functioning brain cell) would read and the fail / resulting convo would never have happened. Hmmm did you feel that shudder. It was a time paradox caused by that last statement!!!!!!

Viper

[stuartm]

Just a thought, but maybe an EPG123 FAQ topic might be useful? Then if an issue happens multiple times Gary or someone could post the issue/solution there.

[IT Troll]

Nothing really for Troll and I to make up for. Ours are just the inevitable differences that occur when you put a stoic, by the book, by the numbers Brit in the same room with the now much looser descendants of those same Brits that relocated to the CORRECT side of the Big Pond 500 years ago.

LOL. With your new dictator's loose tongue, I'm not sure which side of the pond it is best to be on any more.

I have a quick and dirty suggestion that may cure all of this. How about including a short "IMPORTANT NEW INSTALL or UPGRADE INFO ReadMe" file in the EPG123 download. This would go in the same folder as the !!! 13 Page !!! PDF manual and executables. Crucial bullet point info right in front of you with no searching anywhere for it.

The !UPGRADE_README.PDF did exist for a couple of version after the change. I guess Gary felt it wasn't needed any more. People who intended to upgrade would have done so.

(3) *** IMPORTANT *** When upgrading ALWAYS delete the existing tasks and recreate the tasks with the new version.

This really isn't necessary every time. Only for existing pre 1.1 installs. Now you have got over this bump you can go back to straight exe swaps for future updates.

[garyan2]

Just a thought, but maybe an EPG123 FAQ topic might be useful? Then if an issue happens multiple times Gary or someone could post the issue/solution there.

On my list of TODO's.

[ViperJohn]

Well "The Bump" is back and it's a hill this time

I just tried UPDATING (Epg123.cfg was not deleted first) of another non-critical (not an active HTPC) system from 1.0.2 to 1.1.4 and it failed in a new way. The D/L and file save of the lineup went fine but on the import, either auto-match import or a 2nd manual import try (after restoring eHome dat from backup) all I got was an "All Channels Have Been Removed" message upon access of the WMC guide. I am not talking just the unchecking of active channels...I am talking outright completely removed. On the manual try the matching in Epg123client.exe looked fine before the import try but the WMC channel setup was destroyed anyway. I re-ran WMC's signal setup, added the missing channels (7,9,11,13) edited the names back to what they were before so Kodi wouldn't choke only to have v1.1.4 up and kill the WMC channel setup again on the import.

Not even going to try and figure it out this time. Starting from total scratch, which is what I got to finally work on the test system, on the working HTPC with all the scheduling and over 800 recordings ain't even close to an option. I didn't have to start from scratch when I switched the HTPC from MS/Rovi guide updating to EPG123/SD guide updating. Just had to clear the Rovi guide data, delete the old Rovi based recording schedules then recreate them with the new SD based data. I'll stick with 1.0.2. It works without fail or raising my blood pressure It was an interesting try but I'm Done Thank You.

Viper

[garyan2]

This really isn't necessary every time. Only for existing pre 1.1 installs. Now you have got over this bump you can go back to straight exe swaps for future updates.

Can't say I disagree with anything said here, but I will point out that starting next version, EPG123 will have an installation package! There will now be only 1 setup exe to download for both Win7 and Win8+ and the installation can be Full, Server, or Client. Registry settings and event logger will be configured during the setup to take care of a few of the "typical" setup issues.

EPG123 Install Package

There will also no longer be the console window to monitor the progression of the download and update... we now have windows to show the progress.

EPG123 MXF file download progress windows

2017-06-03.png (10.16 KiB) Viewed 1383 times

LoadMXF import progess window

2017-06-03 (1).png (4.47 KiB) Viewed 1383 times

[garyan2]

Well "The Bump" is back and it's a hill this time

I just tried UPDATING (Epg123.cfg was not deleted first) of another non-critical (not an active HTPC) system from 1.0.2 to 1.1.4 and it failed in a new way. The D/L and file save of the lineup went fine but on the import, either auto-match import or a 2nd manual import try (after restoring eHome dat from backup) all I got was an "All Channels Have Been Removed" message upon access of the WMC guide. I am not talking just the unchecking of active channels...I am talking outright completely removed. On the manual try the matching in Epg123client.exe looked fine before the import try but the WMC channel setup was destroyed anyway. I re-ran WMC's signal setup, added the missing channels (7,9,11,13) edited the names back to what they were before so Kodi wouldn't choke only to have v1.1.4 up and kill the WMC channel setup again on the import.

Not even going to try and figure it out this time. Starting from total scratch, which is what I got to finally work on the test system, on the working HTPC with all the scheduling and over 800 recordings ain't even close to an option. I didn't have to start from scratch when I switched the HTPC from MS/Rovi guide updating to EPG123/SD guide updating. Just had to clear the Rovi guide data, delete the old Rovi based recording schedules then recreate them with the new SD based data. I'll stick with 1.0.2. It works without fail or raising my blood pressure It was an interesting try but I'm Done Thank You.

Viper

Did you try the utility I linked on the second post?

[garyan2]

I am not talking just the unchecking of active channels...I am talking outright completely removed.

I have seen this a few times whereas when a station is removed from the download, the channel disappears in the tuner list. For OTA users, you can go to TV Signal->Scan for More Channels and Delete All then Scan Again... this will get the tuner channels back.

For a failure like this for Cable/Satellite, I think just going through 'Set Up TV Signal' again would get everything back up.

Since you are an early adapter, this may be residual from an early method I used to match and unmatch guide listings... it was not as clean and safe as it could have been. The code I use now for the match and unmatch is the same as what MS uses in their code so should be much safer.

[ViperJohn]

Nothing really for Troll and I to make up for. Ours are just the inevitable differences that occur when you put a stoic, by the book, by the numbers Brit in the same room with the now much looser descendants of those same Brits that relocated to the CORRECT side of the Big Pond 500 years ago.

LOL. With your new dictator's loose tongue, I'm not sure which side of the pond it is best to be on any more.

Amen to that. It's not just his loose lips ... it's his even looser screws!!!

[IT Troll]

Can't say I disagree with anything said here, but I will point out that starting next version, EPG123 will have an installation package! There will now be only 1 setup exe to download for both Win7 and Win8+ and the installation can be Full, Server, or Client. Registry settings and event logger will be configured during the setup to take care of a few of the "typical" setup issues.

There will also no longer be the console window to monitor the progression of the download and update... we now have windows to show the progress.

Looking good! Nice to see my logo is still in service. Although not pictured, I take the installer will allow you to choose your preferred installation folder?

The !UPGRADE_README.PDF did exist for a couple of version after the change. I guess Gary felt it wasn't needed any more. People who intended to upgrade would have done so.

This PDF is still included with the migration utility for v1.0.2 and below upgrades.

[ViperJohn]

I am not talking just the unchecking of active channels...I am talking outright completely removed.

I have seen this a few times whereas when a station is removed from the download, the channel disappears in the tuner list. For OTA users, you can go to TV Signal->Scan for More Channels and Delete All then Scan Again... this will get the tuner channels back.

For a failure like this for Cable/Satellite, I think just going through 'Set Up TV Signal' again would get everything back up.

Since you are an early adapter, this may be residual from an early method I used to match and unmatch guide listings... it was not as clean and safe as it could have been. The code I use now for the match and unmatch is the same as what MS uses in their code so should be much safer.

I didn't try the utility since I auto-matched initially and the only EPG123 version this rig has ever had is v1.0.2 .. nothing earlier.

EPG123 didn't even know it dorked the channels in WMC. According to it's readout the update and import and auto-match was a success. Now I am not 100% sure on the A-match readout as I just skimmed that part but all 12 channels were indicated as matched. It did seem like the A-match took much longer than normal though and the match was obviously incorrect.

Also channels 7,9,11,13, which I ALWAYS have to manually add in after WMC's channel scan were still listed on WMC's "Add" page but did not show in the "Edit" page along with the other 8 channels that went AWOL.

I am confused about this:
"I have seen this a few times whereas when a station is removed from the download, the channel disappears in the tuner list."
Nothing was removed from the D/L. Once the "Include" line was in the EPG123.cfg file all 12 OTA channels info D/L's perfect from SD.

I will try once more using the Match Utility and/or your "Scan for More" - "Delete All" - "Rescan" method if needed.

Viper

[garyan2]

Also channels 7,9,11,13, which I ALWAYS have to manually add in after WMC's channel scan were still listed on WMC's "Add" page but did not show in the "Edit" page along with the other 8 channels that went AWOL.

Yes, the strangeness that is WMC. When this, whatever it is, occurs the tuner channels are flagged and the tunerInfo is cleared. They are still in the database but just not usable. The problem is since they already exist in the database, you can't just "add" them back in. You have to delete the channel entirely to add it again either manually or another scan. That is why the need for "Delete All" and "Scan Again" for the UHF channels, and why you will have to delete your existed user created channels and add them back in as well.

I am confused about this:
"I have seen this a few times whereas when a station is removed from the download, the channel disappears in the tuner list."
Nothing was removed from the D/L. Once the "Include" line was in the EPG123.cfg file all 12 OTA channels info D/L's perfect from SD.

I suppose a little further description should be warranted.

Without using the utility, the unique ID for each channel is changed, so when the mxf file is imported it is as if you had removed that channel from the D/L and it would need to be unmatched. The automatch routine would then see the new channel (same channel different ID) and match that one. So each channel is doing an unmatch followed by a match.

Using the utility, it imports an mxf file that contains both the old and the new unique ID for each channel so that they both exist in the database at the same time. Since they are both linked to the same service (station), each is a backup for the other. When we then import an mxf file with only the new ID, the old ID simply disappears leaving the already existing new ID where it needs to be.