RF Channel is incorrect. How to change?

[SunnyR]

During setup process, in the step "TV Signal Provider", WMC gave me 2 choices - "SF-Oak-SJ OTA", and "Oakland OTA"
Both choices cause me a similar problem.

After choosing one (SF-Oak-SJ OTA), WMC continues with the remaining set up.

All - except ONE channel, which I used to get - are correct.

ABC gets only 1 bar out of 6. I used to get 5 or 6 bars, until just last week.
On looking around the info within WMC, I see that ABC (Virtual channel 7.1, KGO (aka ABC7) San Francisco) has its source as RF channel 35.
It SHOULD be RF channel 7 for the transmission tower (Sutro Tower, SF.)
RF channel 35 transmission channel # for ABC coming from a DIFFERENT transmission tower!!

I get to see that ABC is mapped or sourced (if that's the right term) from RF Channel 35 by going to "Edit Channel" > "Edit Source".
"Channel 35" is shown at the bottom, (without the word "RF"); but from googling, I know that "Channel 35" is the "RF Channel" #.
NOTE - I am not trying to do anything with the digital antenna "source". I go to "Edit Source" because that's the only screen within WMC where I can find the RF channel of a given station.

I used to get ABC just fine until just a week or so ago.

What I did was to choose the other "TV Signal Provider" "Oakland OTA".
After going through the entire set up sequence, I got ABC - 6 out of 6 bars.
I use the same method "Edit Channel" > "Edit Source", and see that now, ABC's RF channel is correctly shown as "Channel 7".

Now, you'd think I can just stick with "Oakland OTA" as my choice. But FOX does NOT come through!
An analogous issue occurs. Fox (Virtual Channel 2.1, KTVU SF) is shown to have RF Channel 48. It SHOULD be Channel 44. With the "SF-Oak-SJ OTA" choice, I do indeed get FOX, properly coming in as RF Channel 44.

So now I'm in a bind. Each of the two "TV Signal Provider" is "mapping" (if that's the right term) one virtual-to-RF channel incorrectly.

I don't see any user interface where I can force a channel to be mapped to the correct RF channel.

I hope I'm making sense. Could anyone out there help?

(I'm on Window 7; use HDHomerun dual tuner; San Francisco greater area; antenna has direct line of sight to the transmission tower (Sutro Tower).
None of these have changed for some years. Always got ABC, FOX, and the "major" channels, until a week ago, which prompted a series of test, restarts, and discover the incorrect RF channel assignment being the culprit for "losing" a channel.)

[cwinfield]

Did you try scanning for channels in the HD homerun app 1st? I use cable card but I see people frequently need to edit the channels manually using the guide, edit channels, auto scan, manually change settings, etc...

Here is a post about merging 2 different guide listings http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... ong#p99069

[3rob3]

This may help you too:
https://www.silicondust.com/support/tro ... nal-in-wmc

[SunnyR]

Thanks, folks.
3rob3, The Silicon dust link you post seems very promising. I'll try it as soon as I have the chance later today. Will report back.

[SunnyR]

Cwinfield, yes, I did rescan using the HomeRun setup. (But its mapping was correct to begin with, and remains correct after the rescan.)

[SunnyR]

Well, I tried the solution suggested in Silicon support page that 3rob3 posted with high hopes, but it didn't address the issue.

What the support page tries to fix is if WMC pulls in MORE THAN ONE RF channel mapping for a given virtual channel, the page tells you how to use the Silicon tuner Setup page to first look up the correct RF mapping, then go into WMC, (affected channel> Edit Channel> Edit Source), and uncheck the wrong RF channel *supposedly* already in WMC, thereby leaving only the correct RF channel mapping. However, WMC only has ONE (wrong) RF channel mapping (for ABC7). I don't have a choice to uncheck the wrong RF channel to leave behind the right one.

So this is a problem with WMC. When I (have to) choose the "TV Signal Provider" during setup, the particular set up ("SF-Oak-SJ") pulls in the wrong RF/tuner channel to Virtual Channel mapping for ABC. And it ONLY pulls in ONE wrong mapping, (unlike what the Silicon support page suggests, pulling in a right and a wrong one.)

So
1. how do I hack WMC so that I can change ABC's RF channel to the correct one? (The "right" way is not available to me, as the Silicon support page suggests.)

2. and since this problem suddenly showed up 7-10 days ago without my having done any changes to WMC, how did this incorrect mapping occur? Is this downloaded every time with the Guide? If so, even if I can hack the RF channel back to the correct one, won't it revert to the wrong mapping every time the Guide updates? (I am just hypothesizing here, because the Guide is the only thing I can think of that changes constantly within WMC. How/what else would make the RF channel mapping suddenly change on me otherwise?? )
(BTW, regardless of the incorrect RF Channel# for ABC, the TV guide listing data itself is correct. Only the RF Channel is incorrectly set to one that is used by a different transmission tower south of where I am.)

[dmagerl]

All you have to do is manually add the channel on the correct frequency using the "add missing channel" menu.

It will then show in the guide without programming information. You'll have to manually associate the guide info with the channel using the "Edit Channel" menu.

Then disable the old channel so it doesnt show in the guide.

[SunnyR]

Wow, Dmagerl, that's IT!

Phew, glad I don't have to hack into config files, or download aux. utilities.

When I manually associate the guide info with the newly added channel, I had the choice to "combine" or "copy". I'm not sure I made the best choice, but I "copy". After that, I disabled the incorrectly mapped channel, as you suggest, so I don't see 2(two) ABC channels on my Guide.

One more question - Do you know if this "sudden" incorrect mapping occurred because it "comes down" with each cycle of the TV Guide download? I'm really curious how this wrong RF channel suddenly showed up.

THANKS a bunch. At least for now, problem solved.

[dmagerl]

Its an error in the download that most probably will be fixed in a few weeks when enough people complain. Every so often, you could re-enable the bad channel and see if it begins working.

[SunnyR]

Thanks, Dmagerl.
I didn't start looking into this problem until 7-10 days after this happened. (We had some big rainstorm for days, so I assumed it was just transmission problem.)

When I started googling about this issue, I saw no hits at all. I also don't see any possible topics that apply within this forum within this last week. I am surprised because it seems like with very populated San Francisco area, many people would be affected. Perhaps different users are describing the problem differently, e.g. no TV signal (because on the surface, that's the problem), and it took a bit of digging to finally zoom in to this wrong RF channel mapping.

Anyway, just out of intellectual curiosity, I will check to see if the disabled channel may end up having the right RF channel later down the line.

Thanks again. Life is back to normal.

[simplyclueless]

Arg! After several hours of troubleshooting, cable swapping, amp futzing, and rescanning - i was convinced that my tuners had finally gone. I had occasional problems with channel 7 on on of the tuners over the years, and thought that this was it. Ordered the new win/quad from hauppague because well, why not. 2 hours later I had a thought, rescanned for all channels again, but instead of choosing SF/OAK/SJ, I chose SF/Sacramento. Bingo, suddenly channel 7 is working perfectly (likely because of the mapping described in this thread). I have to go back and see what was missed over the past week or so. I won't cancel the hauppauge order yet, as it seems like a useful gadget that I'll pop in at some point.

[SunnyR]

SimplyClueless,
I don't know much about tuners, but during the course of this (solved!) problem, I had the occasion to open up the tuner software. In it, I can see the entire list of Virtual Channel to RF (or tuner) Channel mapping. You can also try looking at your tuner software to see and crosscheck if the tuner has the right mapping. In my case, the mapping is all correct on the tuner and the problem was entirely with WMC's "TV Signal Provider" data.

Now that you've chosen SF/Sacramento, and regained your channel 7, you may want to check channels you typically watch to make sure you haven't lost any of those! I had the problem of having the wrong channel 7 (ABC) mapping when I chose "SF/OAK/SJ" (just like you). But when I chose my other option "Oakland", I gained ABC7, but lost FOX! You may or may not have this issue with your SF/Sacramento choice. But if you do, the solution suggested by dmagerl (post #7 above) definitely does the trick. You just have to know the correct RF channel if you add a new channel.

This list is quite useful for that. http://www.choisser.com/sfonair.html
If it doesn't cover your transmission tower, you can google and find another source of info. (I imagine you are Sutro Tower, as that corresponds to SF/OAK/SJ mapping.)

[SunnyR]

SimplyClueless,
I am curious when did you notice that you lost your Channel 7? I noticed it soon after the new year.

[mismjy1]

I'm sure I have the same problem as you, since I'm in SF and also lost KGO in the past week or two, and still pulls in fine on HDHomeRun view. However, I must be missing something in regard to the fix.

Here's what I've done:
- Setup TV signal again in WMC
- Enter my zip code and select "SF-Oak-SJ" for antenna
- Go to Setting-TV-Guide-Edit Channels
- Edit KGO / 7.1

When I do this, KGO still shows up at 7.1 (not 35) which should be correct for Sutro. Am I missing something?

[SunnyR]

What you're doing is not the "fix".

But first let me clarify. When you do the following -
- Go to Setting-TV-Guide-Edit Channels
- Edit KGO / 7.1 - this is not it.
The "7.1" that you see is the Virtual Channel, or the end user channel. (e.g. KQED would be 9; NBC would be 11.)

From that edit page, on the left column, choose "Edit Source". At the bottom of that page, you should see "Channel number" showing 35.1. That "Channel number" is better referred to as RF Channel (in many online references), or Tuner Channel (in the HDHomerun software).

For ABC7, 35.1 is NOT our RF Channel from Sutro.

Instead what you do is this -
Task Settings-> TV-> Guide -> Add missing channels -> Add DTV channel (left column)
For"Digital TV Channel", fill in 7.1. (That's your new ABC"7".)
For Assigned Frequency, fill in "7". (This is the CORRECT RF Channel # for ABC coming from Sutro Tower. Note that it just happens to be also "7". This is just a coincidence. Virtual Chan. # & RF Chan. # have no correlation in their numbers, and are typically different.)
For name, fill in "new-ABC". (That will be replaced, you'll see later.)

You've now added a "new" Channel 7 (ABC7), with the correct RF Chan. (happens to be 7.)
If you go to your TV guide, you'll see that listing "7.1 new-ABC", next to the existing (non-functioning) "7.1 ABC".
There will be no TV guide listing for the new-ABC.
But go ahead and try to watch it live. Your channel is back!

Now to get the TV guide listing.
Task Settings->TV->Guide ->Edit Channel
Click on your "new-ABC"
Click Edit Listing.
[easier at this point to choose "Sort by Name" on the left column]
Scroll down and choose 7.1 KGO-HDTV-ABC.
The next screen ask if you want to "Combine" or "Copy" the two 7.1 listings.
I chose "Copy". This keeps the old one as is.

What you've done is you've copied the TV Guide for 7.1 KGO-HDTV-ABC to be used for your new-ABC.

Now if you go to look at your TV Guide, you'll see TWO "7.1 ABC". (The name "new-ABC" has now been replaced because of the listing copy.)
I believe the 1st listing is the bad one. Just try to watch it and confirm that it's the bad one. Right-click on the "7.1 ABC" and "Disable". You won't see it on your TV Guide anymore. But it's still be in various places, e.g. TV signal scan, when you "Edit Channels", you'll see TWO 7.1. One would be active and checked. The other one is the one you disable, and will be unchecked.

You can go ahead and do the same for channel 7.2, 7.3. Add each of the channels; edit (i.e. copy) the TV listing; disable the non-working one.

Hope this helps. Since we're in the same area, I'm sure you'll get this problem solved.

[SunnyR]

BTW, FWIW, if you look at Edit Channel for your newly added channel 7, you'll see that at the BOTTOM of that page, the "Channel number" now shows "7". That is the correct RF chan. 7 coming from Sutro.

[mismjy1]

Worked like a charm - thanks for the detailed instructions!

[SunnyR]

Great!

[simplyclueless]

SimplyClueless,
I am curious when did you notice that you lost your Channel 7? I noticed it soon after the new year.

It started missing shows on Jan 9. I saw the occasional "no signal" error in the task bar, but I would then check and confirm that things were recording fine. It took me a little while to realize that 7 was completely hosed each time. It looks like the SF/Sacramento setting works fine for me at this point, as all of the majors are showing up fine with signal and guide data. I had fixed the problem before coming here to TGB to see if other people had issues, and if I had I'd likely have tried the real fix as described in this thread.

[SunnyR]

mismuy1,
BTW, if you have recordings scheduled on the "old" (non-working, now-disabled) Chan. 7, you need to redo all of them on the new functioning Chan 7, because as far as WMC goes, it considers those two to be different, unrelated stations, (even though they "share" the same TV listings.) It doesn't know to transfer the existing recording schedule to the new channel.