Windows 10 Media Center

Discussion of getting WMC to work on Windows 10 (unsupported)
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tony_park

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#121

Post by tony_park » Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:40 am

I'm currently considering a move to Kodi, after upgrading my pcs to windows 10, so checking out the interfaces to see which is most like MC so that the wife won't moan.

Wonder if we can get de-supported Arcsoft TMT to run from it...

bob_p

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#122

Post by bob_p » Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:41 pm

Kodi still doesn't appear to work with CableCard/DRM-protected channels. Unless someone else is able to get the CableCard certification OR the cable industry relaxes the CableCard protections (both unlikely), WMC remains the only option for watching all cable programs.

If Microsoft decides to keep WMC out of Windows 10 - what will happen to SiliconDust and Ceton? Are there markets large enough for them to get an alternate product or partner with someone like Kodi to get an alternative system certified for use with CableCard?

richard1980

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#123

Post by richard1980 » Wed Mar 04, 2015 1:12 pm

The player (WMC, Kodi, MythTV, etc) does not talk to the CableCARD, nor does it get any kind of CableLabs certification. The player is completely unaware of the existence of the CableCARD. The tuner is the only thing that can talk to the CableCARD. The tuner receives the incoming signal from the cable company, and with the help of the CableCARD, removes the cable company's encryption, applies WM-DRM encryption, and then spits out the result to the player. The only thing the player knows is it requested a stream from the tuner and it received a WM-DRM-encrypted response. In order to actually play that response, the player has to subscribe to the services offered by PlayReady. The player sends the response it receives from the tuner to PlayReady, and PlayReady makes the determination as to whether playback should be allowed or not.

To be very clear, any player can request a stream from any tuner (provided the code required to communicate with the tuner is included in the player's code), and any player can subscribe to the services offered by PlayReady to allow playback of WM-DRM protected content (provided the code required to communicate with PlayReady is included in the player's code). As it stands now, there are several alternative players that can communicate with CableCARD tuners, but none of those players subscribe to PlayReady's services, and that is why those players can't play protected content.

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DavidinCT

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#124

Post by DavidinCT » Wed Mar 04, 2015 3:55 pm

STC wrote:^ I agree. It is well known MC is a legacy product. My reference was to including it in Windows 10 which would entail having to adjust architecture and provide continued support.

Whilst you say it runs fine on 8, it does not support 3rd party extenders which limits overall functionality.

My gut feeling is they will bin it.
Yea, it's too bad, I wish there was more demand for it, as of a lot of people requested it, they might think of brining it back. Sad to say we are a small group when it comes to a global scale. I put a few Tweets up on it and maybe got it re-tweeted 10-15 times, we are not going to change the world that way....

Just wish MS would finish they version that they were working on, even if it had most of the feature set and a new look.

I guess if enough people do complain we might still see it in Windows 10 (stripped down more I am sure) but, MAN, a update and some new features is not just a dream, it's a fantasy at this point.

sugh.
-Dave
Twitter @TheCoolDave

Windows Media Center certified and WMC MVP 2010 - 2012

Woland

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#125

Post by Woland » Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:48 pm

bob_p wrote:Kodi still doesn't appear to work with CableCard/DRM-protected channels. Unless someone else is able to get the CableCard certification OR the cable industry relaxes the CableCard protections (both unlikely), WMC remains the only option for watching all cable programs.

If Microsoft decides to keep WMC out of Windows 10 - what will happen to SiliconDust and Ceton? Are there markets large enough for them to get an alternate product or partner with someone like Kodi to get an alternative system certified for use with CableCard?
Don't they almost have to do something? The end of Windows 8 support is still a long way out, but if Media Center doesn't run under Windows 10, they'll be trying to sell products that only works on an OS that:
1) Doesn't come installed on new computers.
2) A lot of people really dislike (unless they continue to run Windows 7, but it leaves support before 8).
3) Microsoft is trying to airbrush out of history with Windows 10.
4) Eventually will be an unsupported product at MS.

EDIT: fix a typo and mention Windows 7

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tony_park

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#126

Post by tony_park » Fri Mar 06, 2015 9:28 am

Fortunately, we don't have cablecards or protected content in the UK.

I would much prefer that MS provided MC with windows 10, but as has been mentioned, its time has been and gone.

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mark1234

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#127

Post by mark1234 » Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:13 am

tony_park wrote:Fortunately, we don't have cablecards or protected content in the UK.
Maybe if we did have Cablecards here I might still be running Media Centre instead of having switched to Tivo.

(NB, for the picky: We do have subscription cards on cable, but Virgin is under no obligation to allow 3rd party equipment onto its network, so it doesn't. Each card is locked to the specific device that Virgin issue to that customer, meaning it would be useless in anything else, even my neighbour's Virgin box)
Windows Media Centre - Abandoned by Microsoft

manielse

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#128

Post by manielse » Sun Mar 08, 2015 1:42 pm

richard1980 wrote:The player (WMC, Kodi, MythTV, etc) does not talk to the CableCARD, nor does it get any kind of CableLabs certification. The player is completely unaware of the existence of the CableCARD. The tuner is the only thing that can talk to the CableCARD. The tuner receives the incoming signal from the cable company, and with the help of the CableCARD, removes the cable company's encryption, applies WM-DRM encryption, and then spits out the result to the player. The only thing the player knows is it requested a stream from the tuner and it received a WM-DRM-encrypted response. In order to actually play that response, the player has to subscribe to the services offered by PlayReady. The player sends the response it receives from the tuner to PlayReady, and PlayReady makes the determination as to whether playback should be allowed or not.

To be very clear, any player can request a stream from any tuner (provided the code required to communicate with the tuner is included in the player's code), and any player can subscribe to the services offered by PlayReady to allow playback of WM-DRM protected content (provided the code required to communicate with PlayReady is included in the player's code). As it stands now, there are several alternative players that can communicate with CableCARD tuners, but none of those players subscribe to PlayReady's services, and that is why those players can't play protected content.
To be clear, when you say "tuner", are you referring to something such as a HD Homerun Prime device that is directly communicating to the CableCard?

richard1980

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#129

Post by richard1980 » Sun Mar 08, 2015 2:22 pm

To clarify, only a CableCARD tuner can communicate with a CableCARD, and any player can request a stream from any tuner (whether that tuner is a CableCARD tuner or some other kind of tuner), provided the code required to communicate with the tuner is included in the player's code.

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DavidinCT

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#130

Post by DavidinCT » Wed Mar 11, 2015 1:00 pm

At least Microsoft is hearing the demand on Windows Media Center....(MS has someone from the preview team taking feedback and replying on issues on windowscentral.com )

http://forums.windowscentral.com/window ... ost3015988

If you ARE using Windows 10 preview and WANT Windows Media Center to be included or at least an option, PLEASE EVERYONE use the Feedback took in W10 to request or hop on someone else's request and on uservoice.

The ONLY way we can make this happen is to be vocal about it, we need everyone who uses WMC to say something about it. If you really want it in Windows 10, make yourself heard...

See my posts on Twitter using the hash tag #WindowsMediaCenter or tweet to MS using it WE want WMC back and updated !!!!!!

Please don't let it die
-Dave
Twitter @TheCoolDave

Windows Media Center certified and WMC MVP 2010 - 2012

IownFIVEechos

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#131

Post by IownFIVEechos » Wed Mar 11, 2015 1:53 pm

They will need to downgrade the RDP service (or whatever it is) to allow legacy extenders work, and they will have to make sure they are not charging a subscription fee to use windows. Then I will throw my support into the ring. Otherwise windows 7 will have to run into the 2050's!

handyd

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#132

Post by handyd » Wed Mar 11, 2015 5:18 pm

I never heard of UserVoice before, but found the website:

https://windows.uservoice.com

I recommend everyone go to the website
Search (lower right corner) on the topic "Windows Media Center"
Find the Topic: "Include Windows Media Center inWindows 10 standard/home edition"
and Vote. Let's see if we can get it to the top of the list.

I only picked that one topic because it already have over 1500 votes.

I would also like to see everyone vote on this topic to allow us to create our own Extenders.
"Integrate a software Media Center Extender"

Sharks

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#133

Post by Sharks » Mon Mar 16, 2015 12:32 pm

Anyone else notice in the hololens video what seems to be a live soccer game that one of the users is watching? I'm hopeful that is in fact a suggestion that there will be some sort of media center integration in windows 10 but that is my own personal speculation. Anyone else have thoughts on this video? http://www.microsoft.com/microsoft-hololens/en-us

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DavidinCT

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#134

Post by DavidinCT » Mon Mar 16, 2015 5:48 pm

My reasons why Media Center should come back (a little long posted over at windowscentral)

Read it and if like what I said, please re-tweet it....thx

https://twitter.com/TheCoolDave/status/ ... 5220595712

[Moderator note: off-topic posts deleted]
-Dave
Twitter @TheCoolDave

Windows Media Center certified and WMC MVP 2010 - 2012

mdavej

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#135

Post by mdavej » Tue Mar 17, 2015 9:46 pm

A glimmer of hope (mentions a "Media Center" edition of Win 10)?

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Windows- ... 5967.shtml

(Thanks to Starsky at AVS for the original post)

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IT Troll

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#136

Post by IT Troll » Wed Mar 18, 2015 5:06 pm

handyd wrote:I never heard of UserVoice before, but found the website:

https://windows.uservoice.com

I recommend everyone go to the website
Search (lower right corner) on the topic "Windows Media Center"
Find the Topic: "Include Windows Media Center in Windows 10 standard/home edition"
and Vote. Let's see if we can get it to the top of the list.
Thanks. This seems like the best strategy for keeping it on the radar. You can give it up to 3 votes from your allocation of 20 (per email address).
Are you a Recorded TV HD user or want to give it a try? Check out the new community-made update; Recorded TV HD v2.1.1

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DavidinCT

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#137

Post by DavidinCT » Wed Mar 18, 2015 5:49 pm

Maybe ? A bit of code found inside Windows 10 build 10036 said that there is a "ProfessionalWMC" version....Interesting...

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Windows- ... 5967.shtml
-Dave
Twitter @TheCoolDave

Windows Media Center certified and WMC MVP 2010 - 2012

Embiggens

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#138

Post by Embiggens » Wed Mar 18, 2015 5:58 pm

mdavej wrote:A glimmer of hope (mentions a "Media Center" edition of Win 10)?

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Windows- ... 5967.shtml

(Thanks to Starsky at AVS for the original post)
Does sound encouraging, but of course until we hear otherwise, there's still a chance it's a vestige from 8. Thanks for sharing.

milli260876

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#139

Post by milli260876 » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:16 pm

Way I see it Microsoft want EVERYONE to upgrade even "pirated" editions for free...
Adding the same WMC functionality as 8 so those people upgrade too seems a no-brainer!
Lee

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mcewinter

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#140

Post by mcewinter » Thu Mar 19, 2015 5:41 pm

I haven't seen it discussed much and I'm still confused...is 10 going to be subscription based? I'm not sure what they mean by "free for the first year". If they are moving to a subscription format then it makes a lot of sense why they would enable pirated copies to be upgraded.

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