How Does Windows Home Server Interact with Media Center?

[Greg]

I want to use XBOX extenders in several rooms and have a central Windows 7 computer with Media Center 7 as the command and control computer. I know if I just used the Windows 7 computer as the main server/storage area then everything would use Media Center as the GUI and all would be good.

My question is if I add a WHS (probably 2011 version) for central storage do the extenders still use Media Center from the Windows 7 computer as the GUI when I'm streaming recorded TV or ripped DVD/Blue-Ray?

I was told by a Frye's salesman that when you add a WHS that you don't use Media Center, you use whatever WHS has, which I think is just a folder structure...........no flashy GUI. I really want the same GUI interaction with all of the cover art, etc. that you would get if just using a standalone Windows 7 computer with Media Center.

I'm thinking that the salesman is not correct. I believe the extenders still use Media Center for all aspects.........live and recorded TV, streaming videos, etc. no matter where the media is located (main computer, WHS, NAS). I believe that the extenders do all the communication though Media Center, but Media Center, through the WHS Connect software, which must be loaded on the Windows 7 computer, tells the WHS to stream directly to the extenders instead of from its own hard drive.

Does the Connect software change how Media Center looks as viewed on an extender equipped TV or are you now using a different interface?

Do I understand this correctly? Please help me to understand.

Thanks,
Greg

[Danno100]

XBOX 360 does not contain the "guts" of Media Center. WHS doesn't have it. With the XBOX, to use the WMC interface, you need Win 7. If you just use the connect feature, you wouldn't be able to schedule TV recordings or use Live TV. Also, just connecting to WHS would not provide a nice UI. To me, UI is critical. That is one of the reasons Apple has been so succesful.

For the above reasons, many who use WMC would never purchase WHS, me included.

[SilverRubicon]

I'm a little confused with the salesmans stance, but adding WHS to the mix won't change the UI on the extender. All of the data will be presented as always. I have a Windows Media Center (Win7), WHS 2011, and a lone extender (not counting the 360) and everything works as expected. I don't know if data stored on WHS is sent directly to the extender or through MediaCenter but the extender doesn't make a distinction in how the data is displayed.

The salesman is also wrong about the role WHS will play in the network. You won't use only what WHS brings to the table and you'll continue to use Media Center with some added functionality of WHS.

[Greg]

OK, that sounds great...........the best of both worlds! That's how I was thinking, but it's tough getting that information.

So, in a nutshell through the extender you still are using the full capabilities of WMC7 just like if it was a single box Win 7 set-up.

Are there any issues or peculiarities when using WHS 2011 in conjunction with a Win 7 computer running WMC7? Too bad that they got rid of Drive Extender in WHS 2011.

Thanks again,
Greg

[Danno100]

I wouldn't think so. If you are running Win 7/extender, libaries (folders) in Win 7 can be mapped to any network location (WHS, NAS, another PC). Win 7 controls the files you have access to, not WHS. WHS is just another storage location. The only limitation I know it that Win 7 Media Center TV can not be recorded to a network drive, it can only be recorded to one local drive at a time (but it can "play" back from multiple drives).

[SilverRubicon]

So, in a nutshell through the extender you still are using the full capabilities of WMC7 just like if it was a single box Win 7 set-up.

Yes.

I'll also add that you should ask your self why you want WHS. I thought it would bring together my media center, network storage, and Windows Phone into one beautifully integrated system but that didn't really work out. All the pieces are there, but Microsoft doesn't do a good job of bringing everything together. If what you need is additional storage space, you may be able to get there by adding additional drives to your Media Center and then using Drive Bender to add data duplication and the ability to create large storage pools of data. 3x5 drive bay racks are relatively inexpensive and provide an easy way to add lots of storage quickly. There are great, free software packages that can do the rest of what WHS provides. Web server, backups, etc. There are times I feel I should have gone the single server route thereby eliminating one more machine that is powered 24/7.

http://www.drivebender.com/
http://tinyurl.com/7wnfblj

[gcoupe]

Are there any issues or peculiarities when using WHS 2011 in conjunction with a Win 7 computer running WMC7? Too bad that they got rid of Drive Extender in WHS 2011.

If you value your music metadata (and your sanity), you have to disable a media metadata update task that runs by default on WHS 2011. See the third item in this Microsoft Tech note.

[SilverRubicon]

Are there any issues or peculiarities when using WHS 2011 in conjunction with a Win 7 computer running WMC7? Too bad that they got rid of Drive Extender in WHS 2011.

If you value your music metadata (and your sanity), you have to disable a media metadata update task that runs by default on WHS 2011.

YES! Forgot about that. Has Microsoft still not fixed this?

[gcoupe]

Just to comment on SilverRubicon's question as to whether it's worth investing in WHS 2011. If all you want is a file server, then there are definitely alternatives (including just extending your current Media Center PC - although that might increase noise in an area where quietness is better). WHS is useful in my situation because it combines an excellent and efficient Client PC backup solution with central storage of Media and other common files. There are certainly rough edges on WHS 2011 (see my rants on my blog), but overall I'm prepared to put up with them.

[gcoupe]

YES! Forgot about that. Has Microsoft still not fixed this?

They haven't issued an update if that's what you mean. Only this Technet note, which naturally the vast majority of folks are unaware of. Reminds me of the Hitchhiker's Guide quote:

'But Mr Dent, the plans have been available in the local planning office for the last nine months.'

'Oh yes, well as soon as I heard I went straight round to see them, yesterday afternoon. You hadn't exactly gone out of your way to call attention to them had you? I mean like actually telling anybody or anything.'

'But the plans were on display ...'

'On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them.'

'That's the display department.'

'With a torch.'

'Ah, well the lights had probably gone.'

'So had the stairs.'

'But look, you found the notice didn't you?'

'Yes,' said Arthur, 'yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying Beware of the Leopard.'

[Greg]

Thank you all so much for your input and advice. It does sound like WHS would work for the way I was hoping, but now all of your comments got me thinking.

I'll also add that you should ask your self why you want WHS.

I think the main reason is to hide the server in a closet or somewhere out of site and sound. The all in one box does sound much easier with less hassles. WHS made it appear easier to add storage until 2011 dropped Drive Extender.

Thanks for the link to Drive Bender.........it appears to do everything that Drive Extender did.

As far as recording live TV, I think it would be perfectly acceptable to record to the local drive and then move the files to the WHS later. Can these moves be done automatically at pre-scheduled times.......say always at 3 AM?

So, more questions (I'm a noob at this stuff):

- How does Drive Bender work with streaming, especially HD content, such as ripped Bluerays? Does it get in the way, such as can it cause stuttering? Or maybe more importantly, does it cause any issues with recording live TV because of the "on the fly management" that Drive Bender does?

- Is there a way to hide the drive bays, say in a closet and still connect the cage to the computer located in another room. Something tells me no, because you would need some long cables..........if they even exist.

- How loud would a server be with maybe 3 or 4 drives?

- Can the server be put to sleep (low power mode) and then come to life when a scheduled TV recording is about to air, or some other activity is happening?

In most ways the single box Win 7 solution appears to be the best and simplest, but for an out of site system the WHS (or another Win 7 box) appears to be the only solution (although this now requires 2 boxes)..........unless you can separate the drive cage a significant distance from the computer SATA cables are only 1 meter max.

Can you leave the PC/drive cage in the closet and just have the keyboard, mouse and monitor in another room?

Thanks again for all of the help,
Greg

[WScottCross]

As far as recording live TV, I think it would be perfectly acceptable to record to the local drive and then move the files to the WHS later. Can these moves be done automatically at pre-scheduled times.......say always at 3 AM?

Not if you use the built-in TV archive function. What I did was create a script that does the copying and have it as a scheduled task that runs at 2AM. I actually have 2 of them, one that copies recorded TV shows to one share and another that handles movies. The movie handler creates separate folders for each movie and copies the movie into the correct folder. This allows third party tools like MyMovies and others to handle the metadata in the way they like to.

So, more questions (I'm a noob at this stuff):

- How does Drive Bender work with streaming, especially HD content, such as ripped Bluerays? Does it get in the way, such as can it cause stuttering? Or maybe more importantly, does it cause any issues with recording live TV because of the "on the fly management" that Drive Bender does?

I didn't have much luck with the DE replacements and just ended up building a big server with 10 2TB drives with a hardware RAID5 controller and now I just don't have to even think about it any more. It just works.

- Is there a way to hide the drive bays, say in a closet and still connect the cage to the computer located in another room. Something tells me no, because you would need some long cables..........if they even exist.

You could do that with an E-Sata box but the max cable length is 2 meters so you can't go far with that.

- How loud would a server be with maybe 3 or 4 drives?

You could build one that's virtually silent, all it takes is money. Seriously, It all depends on the case and processor you use. My server is in the basement, so I don't care about the noise. If you put it in a closet with no airflow, it will heat the closet and could start to cause problems. You could go with a low power Atom based box that wouldn't generate much heat to start with. The drives don't generate much heat at all.

- Can the server be put to sleep (low power mode) and then come to life when a scheduled TV recording is about to air, or some other activity is happening?

It can, but many people have had issues with the delay caused by this. Mine is on 24/7.

In most ways the single box Win 7 solution appears to be the best and simplest, but for an out of site system the WHS (or another Win 7 box) appears to be the only solution (although this now requires 2 boxes)..........unless you can separate the drive cage a significant distance from the computer SATA cables are only 1 meter max.

Can you leave the PC/drive cage in the closet and just have the keyboard, mouse and monitor in another room?

Yes, but again it will heat the closet if there isn't any airflow. You could use RF wireless keyboard and mouse. Don't forget about the remote. I use a Gyration RF Remote/gyro mouse and keyboard that works well, but I don't think they're sold any more. Extending the output to the TV isn't as much of a problem as the do make long HDMI cables.

Having a dedicated server connected with wired ethernet was the best solution for me. It is responsive and holds 16TB of my stuff!

[Greg]

WScottCross,

Thank you for that very detailed response.

I'm leading towards a one box solution using Win 7 stored away in the closet. The closet has a louvered bi-fold door, so it should get plenty of air. I'm also leaning towards using an Xbox 360 as an extender for all activities, including DVD/BD rips. I know that the HTPC route, where I feed the TV directly from an HDMI output of the HTPC, is probably the more versatile way to go, as far as the quality of the rips are concerned, but I will try the Xbox route first. I have a thread in the "7MC Extenders/Xbox 360" forum discussing this issue.

Can you give me more information about the scripts for moving your recorded TV shows and movies? Never wrote a script before.

WOW..........16 TB! I'll start off much smaller. I was thinking of using a rack mount due to the closet constraints.........horizontal orientation works better than vertical. Not sure if separating the drives from the main server using eSATA makes sense, however this would work well in a rack configuration. I would also use a rack mount GB switch and a patch panel for a neat installation. I might even put the modem and router in there, as well.........not sure.

Thanks again,
Greg

[adam1991]

if you're going XBox, the base XBox is $150 at the Microsoft online store right now. $50 off.