Help with troubleshooting please - stuttering, freezing

[Hobbes]

Please excuse the long intro, but I want to provide enough background info to facilitate assistance.

I'm running WMC on a home server streamed to three Xbox 360 extenders. We only watch content via the extenders, not via the server directly.
The server specs: Windows 7 Pro 64-bit, i5-4570 CPU @ 3.2 GHz, 8 GB RAM - tuners are provided by a CETON InfiniTV 6 ETH with a FIOS cable card
The drive configuration is one 250 GB SSD for the system drive, and three 3 TB WD Blue drives for media storage, one of which is the WMC Recorded TV location (H:\).

I've been running WMC with this setup for almost 4 years with no problems, beyond the InfiniTV dropping tuners on occasion. Daily scheduled reboots of the server (mostly) solved that problem.

However, for the past couple of months I've been having problems with video freezing and stuttering. I've been thinking it was related to the Recorded TV HD add-in, since the typical problem is evidenced by the playback or live TV feed freezing and stuttering. This happens for a minute or two until an error message pops up saying that "Recorded TV HD has stopped responding", and once that message is acknowledged playback can resume. This message occurs during playback of recorded content, live channel viewing, and will also occur even if nobody is streaming from the server at all, so there is no one specific activity that seems to trigger it. Unfortunately, this sometimes will also disrupt the recording of programs, resulting in incomplete recordings. I updated Recorded TV HD to the newest beta recently issued, but still no change to the problem.

As I said, I thought it was related to Recorded TV HD, but now I'm not so sure it isn't something else. The other prominent symptom I'm seeing is this error message on the server:
"The Recycle Bin on H:\ is corrupted: Do you want to empty the Recycle Bin for this drive?"
The H:\ drive is the recording location for WMC. Emptying the Bin or deleting the Bin from the H:\ drive and rebooting haven't fixed this error, which recurs every day, even with the daily reboots. I did swap out the H:\ drive with another 3 TB Blue drive that I formatted, scanned and performed a full-disk write (1's & 0's) on first to ensure it was a healthy drive, but no change in the problem.

Can anybody provide any guidance on additional troubleshooting or corrective steps I can take? This problem has become quite disruptive to normal use of WMC and I'm not sure what else to try to fix it. Thanks.

[tonywagner]

So the stuttering and freezing is present within the recordings themselves? If you watch a recording in another program, it will stutter and freeze over the exact same spot each time?

I’m not a Recorded TV HD user, but can you try removing it completely? You could do a system image first and restore back to it later, if you want to keep the configuration.

A tuner test might be advisable too?

[stuartm]

If the stuttering is always in the same place when watching a recorded program than it indicates a tuner problem. If you can watch the recorded program and the stuttering moves or does not always happen then it indicates a disk (or network) problem. If possible, try watching directly on the machine that holds the recording, if the stuttering happens there then it is not a network problem. Also if you are using wireless to the extenders try a wired connection and see if the problem still happens. Even though you replaced the disk the messages about the corrupted recycle bin seem to indicate a disk problem. Possibly a cabling or controller problem. If you can, replace or check the cabling to the H drive as well as trying to move it to a different controller/port and see if the problem persists.

[Hobbes]

It's difficult to draw a firm conclusion that glitches in the recordings line up with the timing of the glitches in real time, but yes there are disruptions to recordings. Mostly the recording continues and the rest of the recording proceeds fine, but sometimes the recording fails and you only get a portion of the program (e.g., 23 minutes of a 60-minute show). In the recordings that complete you will sometimes come across a "bad patch" where the recording is glitchy, but you can skip past that part and the remainder is fine.

Also, all connections are ethernet, no wireless.

[RedWMC]

I wonder if your ceton tuner is beginning to fail. When my Ceton 4 USB started failing I think I experienced similar. If you have another tuner to test that might be a good way to test.

Or setup another program that can use the tuner to try to rule out WMC.

[Kimifelipe]

I am having trouble with my data id being reset daily on one internal infinitv4 - wonder if I am experiencing a similar issue.

not to threadjack, but the reason I am posting here is to ask - does anyone know of a place to purchase new cablecard tuners? or suitable replacement infinitv 4 or 6's? is the Hauppauge tuner a reliable device?

I would check the harddrive after doing what you have done so far - make sure its not failing; it is possible it is failing at the write stage, whereas I imagine from stuart's suggestion he is talking about failing a read (which is less of an issue and iirc would not always occur at the same place). if you have a replacement, put it in and see if there is any difference.

[Hobbes]

I did put in a new storage drive, and there has been no change whatsoever in the problems. At this point I have to think it isn't a storage drive problem since two different drives have evidenced the exact same symptoms. I guess it could be an issue with the system drive, but the Recycle Bin error shows up on the storage drive that WMC records to.

As far as I know, WMC doesn't even use the Recycle Bin, correct? I'm not sure what would cause the corruption of the Recycle Bin, since the only thing using the drive is WMC. The whole thing is perplexing.

[Hobbes]

I wonder if your ceton tuner is beginning to fail. When my Ceton 4 USB started failing I think I experienced similar. If you have another tuner to test that might be a good way to test.

Or setup another program that can use the tuner to try to rule out WMC.

Unfortunately I don't have access to another tuner. While the tuner may be an issue, the problems often occur strictly on playback of recorded content, so I'm not sure the tuners are even in use at that time.

[RedWMC]

- does anyone know of a place to purchase new cablecard tuners? or suitable replacement infinitv 4 or 6's? is the Hauppauge tuner a reliable device?
.

HDHOMERUN Prime is the only active development cable card tuner in the market that I’m aware of.
The frustrating part is they currently only have a 3 tuner. They are releasing a 6 tuner soon.

https://www.silicondust.com/product/hdhomerun-prime-6/

Just logged onto their website and amazon and I don’t see the 3 for sale new. So you may have to find it used.
Overall my HDHomeRun Prime has worked far better than my ceton especially since my ceton started to die.

[stuartm]

Unfortunately I don't have access to another tuner. While the tuner may be an issue, the problems often occur strictly on playback of recorded content, so I'm not sure the tuners are even in use at that time.

If the tuner is having problems then the recordings will have the glitches in them so the problem will show when a bad recording is being played. This is why the question about if the recording is played repeatedly does the error always show at the same place. (If so, the problem most likely happened during the recording process)

[tonywagner]

It's difficult to draw a firm conclusion that glitches in the recordings line up with the timing of the glitches in real time, but yes there are disruptions to recordings.

Perhaps I wasn't clear. If there is a glitch in the recording, and you can rewind and see the glitch again in the same spot, then it's likely a tuner issue.

[Space]

HDHOMERUN Prime is the only active development cable card tuner in the market that I’m aware of.
The frustrating part is they currently only have a 3 tuner. They are releasing a 6 tuner soon.

https://www.silicondust.com/product/hdhomerun-prime-6/

Just logged onto their website and amazon and I don’t see the 3 for sale new. So you may have to find it used.
Overall my HDHomeRun Prime has worked far better than my ceton especially since my ceton started to die.

According to the CEO of Silicon Dust, the HDHR Prime 3 tuner model is no longer manufactured due to parts no longer being available. As for the announced 6-tuner model of the Prime, "coming soon" is just a lie unless you think "soon" is measured in years.

[stuartm]

Sadly, the 6 tuner Prime has been "coming soon" since it was first announced several years ago. And as Space says the 3 tuner prime is no longer in production. The cable card tuner market is pretty bleak right now as Ceton also went out of business a few years back. The SiliconDust Primes were always reliable tuners and for tuner replacement your best bet is to look for used ones on EBay. (Assuming you narrow down your problem to the tuner)

[Hobbes]

It's difficult to draw a firm conclusion that glitches in the recordings line up with the timing of the glitches in real time, but yes there are disruptions to recordings.

Perhaps I wasn't clear. If there is a glitch in the recording, and you can rewind and see the glitch again in the same spot, then it's likely a tuner issue.

Ah, I see your point. No, typically when the glitches occur during playback I can eventually rewind and replay that same section of program and there won't be a similar disruption.

Separately, I do see some dropouts in a few recordings. My assumption is that those programs were recording when glitches occurred, and that disrupted the recording at that point. Most recordings continue without further incident, but a few seem to fail at that point and I don't get a full recording. Since these are recordings made at an earlier time it is difficult to be sure that the recording errors actually coincide with the glitches, that is just my speculation.

[stuartm]

So if that is the case it is more likely a disk or network problem. Even though you replaced the disk it could be the cable or a controller problem. or still a network problem given that you watch on extenders and record via network attached tuner. As I suggested earlier try watching something on the server itself rather than via extender to help rule out network problems. e.g. switch may be going bad. Also try replacing disk cables and/or moving to a different port if you have one available. Switches are pretty cheap so you may want to try just replacing that. I don't know your network topology but it is best to have the tuner, recording PC and extenders on their own switch and not connected directly to your router.

[Hobbes]

Thanks for the continued suggestions. It's not easy to watch programs directly from the server since I'd have to sit at a desk in my home office and watch on a monitor, as that is where the server is located. There's no way to know how long it may take to experience the problem, so not a good watching environment. I do see the warning messages on the server itself, not just on the extenders, but I haven't seen the actual glitch directly on the server because I don't watch content there.

The network connections for all equipment go through a NetGear switch, which is the only thing connected to the router. I suppose the switch could be acting up, though it is fairly new. I can also get some new disk cables to try that solution, though I was hoping there was some sort of testing or narrowing down of the problem I could try before replacing random items in hope of a solution. Perhaps that isn't viable though. A network problem does seem like a promising possibility.

[tonywagner]

Thanks for the continued suggestions. It's not easy to watch programs directly from the server since I'd have to sit at a desk in my home office and watch on a monitor, as that is where the server is located. There's no way to know how long it may take to experience the problem, so not a good watching environment. I do see the warning messages on the server itself, not just on the extenders, but I haven't seen the actual glitch directly on the server because I don't watch content there.

I can usually find glitches in my video files by running them through FFMPEG. Download it and run it something like the following:

Code: Select all

ffmpeg.exe -i "C:\path\to\video.wtv" -map 0 -c copy -y "C:\path\to\temp.ts"

If I run that on a file with a reception or network glitch, I usually see something like "Non-monotonous DTS in output stream" in the command's output. (And you can delete the "temp.ts" file when you are done.)

Try it on a video file with known glitches and see if it returns something similar.

[RedWMC]

[quote="tonywagner"
I can usually find glitches in my video files by running them through FFMPEG. Download it and run it something like the following:

Code: Select all

ffmpeg.exe -i "C:\path\to\video.wtv" -map 0 -c copy -y "C:\path\to\temp.ts"

.[/quote]

Brilliant, I’m going to have to use this myself!

On the HdHomeRun6, I only said it was coming soon because last I looked in November they say Spring 2019. Then they posted a letter from the CEO, and now it doesn’t even have the date. So who knows when/if it will come out. I feel that vendors are pulling out of the cableTV market as cableTV starts to lose more and more market share to streamingZ So who knows how much effort will be put into the CableTV options in the future.

https://web.archive.org/web/20191107091 ... n-prime-6/

viewtopic.php?t=11902

^Letter from CEO stating they won’t provide a date anymore.

We are still very excited as we plan and develop the updated generation, adding full CableCARD support of 6 simultaneous programs. We had been premature on a few occasions in announcing this product creating expectations from our fans (and the occasional dramatic naysayers).

There have been chipsets that were sold off and killed in the middle of our dev (twice). And delays due to normal development that many don't know nor deem relevant beyond "just give me my PRIME!" and we respect and love that passion. .

I want to assure all of our customers and fans that we are still deep in development of the upcoming PRIME6 and we will announce only when the time is right and when we are in mass production