Odd Incomplete Guide Data Problem

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Odd Incomplete Guide Data Problem

Post#1 » Tue Feb 23, 2016 1:16 am

I have an odd problem where the Media Center Guide is populated with accurate data but some channels have no data. All the channels work properly however.

The missing channel's guide data seems to be for typical local channels that are accessible via ATSC over the air and the same station over cable. So for example, WCBS-DT, WNBC-DT, WNYW-DT, WABC-DT, WWOR-DT, WPIX11-DT and WNET-DT (over the air and over cable) have no data. Other channels like USA, HBO, Showtime, WGN, TNT and so on over cable are properly populated with guide data.

I have another Media Center system that uses a Silicondust HDHomeRun Prime 3x tuner but it doesn't have this problem and has the same channel lineup. The system in question had a problem where it wouldn't download guide data due to the Microsoft crossover / cutover to Rovi guide data from Zap2it. Therefore I had to go through the workaround process outlined in this forum in order to get any guide data on this system at all (again the other system didn't have a problem). After the workaround it worked fine until now.

Guide data for the effected local channels ran out on 2-18-2016.

Any advice would be great!

Thanks in advance.
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Post#2 » Tue Feb 23, 2016 1:27 pm

Maybe its time to undo the workaround. I don't have OTA so I am unable to test my suggestion.
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Post#3 » Tue Feb 23, 2016 6:42 pm

Octavean wrote:I have an odd problem where the Media Center Guide is populated with accurate data but some channels have no data. All the channels work properly however.

The missing channel's guide data seems to be for typical local channels that are accessible via ATSC over the air and the same station over cable. So for example, WCBS-DT, WNBC-DT, WNYW-DT, WABC-DT, WWOR-DT, WPIX11-DT and WNET-DT (over the air and over cable) have no data. Other channels like USA, HBO, Showtime, WGN, TNT and so on over cable are properly populated with guide data.

I have another Media Center system that uses a Silicondust HDHomeRun Prime 3x tuner but it doesn't have this problem and has the same channel lineup. The system in question had a problem where it wouldn't download guide data due to the Microsoft crossover / cutover to Rovi guide data from Zap2it. Therefore I had to go through the workaround process outlined in this forum in order to get any guide data on this system at all (again the other system didn't have a problem). After the workaround it worked fine until now.

Guide data for the effected local channels ran out on 2-18-2016.

Any advice would be great!

Thanks in advance.


I have ran into this same issue.
Channels that are both available OTA and with the CableCard tuner are shown properly (like NBC, ABC, CBS etc...)
The subchannels that are mainly available only in OTA, show no guide data.
I can make them come back if I do a full reset, but they do not get updated over time.

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Post#4 » Tue Feb 23, 2016 7:20 pm

Have you tried running the Objectstore Recovery Task in Task Scheduler? When mine stopped getting data for my subchannels running the task fixed everything.
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Post#5 » Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:18 pm

Thanks.

I thought that might be the case as well but I have some concerns about it. On the system in question, it couldn't complete Media Center setup without the work around (which was first applied about 6 months ago). It would get stuck at the downloading setup info stage.

Still I don't really see what else I could try.

So to undo it I should:

go into the host file
remove the added ip addresses at the bottom of the file
save
flush the DNS
shut down (not restart)
Boot
Setup Media Center again (assuming it will go to completion)
Download guide data
Hope like heck it works again?

Or did I miss a step???
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Post#6 » Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:39 pm

Before I tried the Objectstore Recovery Task my system also reported that it couldn't complete the setup (I was going to attempt to set it up again to see if that worked). Just curious - did you try the Task? Also, if you cannot download after you remove the workaround, you may want to try the Task and then restart.
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Post#7 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 8:46 pm

Thanks for all the replies.

I just wanted to do a follow up to let people know what happened.

I was going to undo the workaround but upon hearing the suggestion here I thought I would try it. This is what I did:

1) opened an elevated cammand prompt
2) flushed DNS with ipconfig /flushdns
2) opened taskschd.msc
3) reran scheduler library > Microsoft > media center > objectstorerecovery via right click > run
4) let run for about 2 min then stop
5) shutdown
6) clean boot
7) Open media center
8) reconfigure TV signal
9) manually download guide

Everything seems to work properly now. So to be clear I didn't undo the workaround but rather repeated the last few steps of it. The added ip addresses are still in the host file. If this happens again I'll consider other action or at worst repeat the process (which would be a drag).

Thanks again everyone!
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Post#8 » Wed Mar 02, 2016 12:56 pm

Practice makes perfect.
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Post#9 » Thu Mar 03, 2016 10:00 pm

Octavean wrote:Thanks for all the replies.

I just wanted to do a follow up to let people know what happened.

I was going to undo the workaround but upon hearing the suggestion here I thought I would try it. This is what I did:

1) opened an elevated cammand prompt
2) flushed DNS with ipconfig /flushdns
2) opened taskschd.msc
3) reran scheduler library > Microsoft > media center > objectstorerecovery via right click > run
4) let run for about 2 min then stop
5) shutdown
6) clean boot
7) Open media center
8) reconfigure TV signal
9) manually download guide

Everything seems to work properly now. So to be clear I didn't undo the workaround but rather repeated the last few steps of it. The added ip addresses are still in the host file. If this happens again I'll consider other action or at worst repeat the process (which would be a drag).

Thanks again everyone!

Do me a favor and check the tail end of the guide - 12 days I think, and please confirm whether the channels that used to show "Data not available" are getting updated.
I've done the procedure above and on the first guide download everything got populated, but subsequent automatic daily downloads never seems to pull those channels.

Thanks,
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Post#10 » Fri Mar 04, 2016 4:13 am

I had the same issue, turned out after changing the DNS servers from the ones the cable provider automatically provides to the ones that google offers the problem went away.
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Post#11 » Fri Mar 04, 2016 4:07 pm

CFC wrote:
Octavean wrote:Thanks for all the replies.

I just wanted to do a follow up to let people know what happened.

I was going to undo the workaround but upon hearing the suggestion here I thought I would try it. This is what I did:

1) opened an elevated cammand prompt
2) flushed DNS with ipconfig /flushdns
2) opened taskschd.msc
3) reran scheduler library > Microsoft > media center > objectstorerecovery via right click > run
4) let run for about 2 min then stop
5) shutdown
6) clean boot
7) Open media center
8) reconfigure TV signal
9) manually download guide

Everything seems to work properly now. So to be clear I didn't undo the workaround but rather repeated the last few steps of it. The added ip addresses are still in the host file. If this happens again I'll consider other action or at worst repeat the process (which would be a drag).

Thanks again everyone!

Do me a favor and check the tail end of the guide - 12 days I think, and please confirm whether the channels that used to show "Data not available" are getting updated.
I've done the procedure above and on the first guide download everything got populated, but subsequent automatic daily downloads never seems to pull those channels.

Thanks,
CFC


Believe me when I say that was one of my major concerns right after I "seemingly" corrected the problem.

For a few days after, I periodically checked auto guide updates and all guide data for all channels seems to be populated with a few exceptions. The exceptions are few and actually make sense in this case. So for example, "ABCFamily" recently changed their callsign to "FreeForm" (I think) and the channel name in Media Center was still ABCF (or something like that). So to correct that I just modified the guide for that channel.

I'm still keeping an eye out for this problem.

I guess going ~6 to ~7 months after implementing the workaround without a problem was a good run but I really hope it doesn't crop up again. What I don't get is why only one of my two Media Center systems would have this issue. Why would only one system require this work around to go through setup and download guide data and the other one wouldn't,....?
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Post#12 » Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:02 pm

Octavean wrote:Believe me when I say that was one of my major concerns right after I "seemingly" corrected the problem.

For a few days after, I periodically checked auto guide updates and all guide data for all channels seems to be populated with a few exceptions. The exceptions are few and actually make sense in this case. So for example, "ABCFamily" recently changed their callsign to "FreeForm" (I think) and the channel name in Media Center was still ABCF (or something like that). So to correct that I just modified the guide for that channel.

I'm still keeping an eye out for this problem.

I guess going ~6 to ~7 months after implementing the workaround without a problem was a good run but I really hope it doesn't crop up again. What I don't get is why only one of my two Media Center systems would have this issue. Why would only one system require this work around to go through setup and download guide data and the other one wouldn't,....?

Thanks!
It's no guarantee that it'll stick for my setup, but at least you've given me hope.
I'll report back on my situation as well once I change it.

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Post#13 » Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:07 pm

For some reason that thread was locked

The system in question is using 2x HD cable set top boxes with 2x Hauppauge HD PVR USB units (via DVBLink for Hauppauge HD PVR) and 2x SiliconDust HDHomeRun units (OTA ATSC mode total of 4x tuners). All of which seems to work fine.

As most people know we Media Center users have been having some issues with the guide not updating properly and each time the guide data becomes available again this problem reasserts itself on this system (not my other system which is cablecard only). To be clear, the local channels such as CBS, NBC, ABC and so on have no updated guide listings regardless of whether they are coming in via OTA ATSC or via the cable box in Media Center. Another example would be that CBS-HD comes in via channel 2.1 (ATSC), channel 2 (SD cable) and channel 602 (HD cable) but none of them have guide data beyond April 12, 8:00am whereas HBO-HD channel 700 (HD cable) and HBO-SD channel 400 (SD cable) have guide data up to the April 19th.

The point at which the guide data stops for the channel in question coincides with the point that guide data wasn't being updated due to some issue (Microsoft / Rovi).

Previously I was able to address this issue by doing the following:

1) open an elevated command prompt
2) flushed DNS with ipconfig /flushdns
2) open taskschd.msc
3) rerun scheduler library > Microsoft > media center > objectstorerecovery via right click > run
4) let run for about 2 min then stop
5) shutdown
6) clean boot
7) Open media center
8) reconfigure TV signal
9) manually download guide

Last time I removed the additional IP addresses I placed in the Host file as a fix during the Rovi cutover hoping it would help prevent this from happening again but it didn't help (didn't seem to hurt either). I guess I can go through this process again but it is a bit of a process to go through every time the guide won't download which seems to be very frequent these days.

Any suggestions would be great!!!

Thanks in advance.

Oct.

BTW, I'm sure someone will suggest EPG123. I'm not against the use of EPG123 especially if it will save me some aggravation here. However, I would like if someone could give me detailed install instructions given that this system uses Hauppauge HD PVR USB units. There is one thread I just started to read using a Hauppauge Colossus involving the installation of EPG123 that I found and it was clearly not as simple an install as it is for other hardware.

Edit:

For what its worth, as far as I know the guide data was updating correctly before the update problems (Microsoft / Rovi). Its hard to tell though because there was such a short time between the times the guide was updating correctly.
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Post#14 » Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:03 pm

Octavean wrote:BTW, I'm sure someone will suggest EPG123. I'm not against the use of EPG123 especially if it will save me some aggravation here. However, I would like if someone could give me detailed install instructions given that this system uses Hauppauge HD PVR USB units. There is one thread I just started to read using a Hauppauge Colossus involving the installation of EPG123 that I found and it was clearly not as simple an install as it is for other hardware.


That was probably my thread. The latest version of EPG123 is working well. I'm not familiar with your hardware but I would suggest that the underlying guide problems that Microsoft has heaped on us will not get any better. I went through a process where I realized that the only real relief was possibly ditching Media Center for another solution...until I found out that EPG123 allowed a complete divorce from this unhealthy dependency on Microsoft.

Removing that dependency has been incredibly liberating. I've now got great guide data out to 20+ days. I suspect that the new version of EPG123 would mean that you should have much less issues with installing it then I did. I'm pretty sure I outlined the steps in the latter parts of my thread but I'm also pretty sure that the new version of EPG123 won't require a lot of them - if any.

Best thing I can suggest is try it out. You will almost certainly sacrifice recording history and scheduled recordings but from my perspective, the situation with Microsoft and Rovi is untenable and it's not going to get better. If a person elects to go with a different DVR solution then typically you need 3rd party guide service anyway and the only one to use is Schedules Direct. So...either way...to me the only way to really get reliable relief is a divorce from Microsoft/Rovi altogether. Otherwise a fella can spend an awful lot of time on connect.microsoft.com on a regular recurring basis.
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Post#15 » Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:04 pm

The original topic is now unlocked. The topic was locked because members were posting about the Spring DST issues in here.
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Post#16 » Fri Apr 08, 2016 2:09 pm

marvin-miller wrote:
Octavean wrote:BTW, I'm sure someone will suggest EPG123. I'm not against the use of EPG123 especially if it will save me some aggravation here. However, I would like if someone could give me detailed install instructions given that this system uses Hauppauge HD PVR USB units. There is one thread I just started to read using a Hauppauge Colossus involving the installation of EPG123 that I found and it was clearly not as simple an install as it is for other hardware.


That was probably my thread. The latest version of EPG123 is working well. I'm not familiar with your hardware but I would suggest that the underlying guide problems that Microsoft has heaped on us will not get any better. I went through a process where I realized that the only real relief was possibly ditching Media Center for another solution...until I found out that EPG123 allowed a complete divorce from this unhealthy dependency on Microsoft.

Removing that dependency has been incredibly liberating. I've now got great guide data out to 20+ days. I suspect that the new version of EPG123 would mean that you should have much less issues with installing it then I did. I'm pretty sure I outlined the steps in the latter parts of my thread but I'm also pretty sure that the new version of EPG123 won't require a lot of them - if any.

Best thing I can suggest is try it out. You will almost certainly sacrifice recording history and scheduled recordings but from my perspective, the situation with Microsoft and Rovi is untenable and it's not going to get better. If a person elects to go with a different DVR solution then typically you need 3rd party guide service anyway and the only one to use is Schedules Direct. So...either way...to me the only way to really get reliable relief is a divorce from Microsoft/Rovi altogether. Otherwise a fella can spend an awful lot of time on connect.microsoft.com on a regular recurring basis.



I suspected that EPG123 would be a suggestion. I have to look into it a bit more. I would also have to test it out on another system first.

The hardware I am using is the Hauppauge HD PVR USB unit which is very similar to the Hauppauge Colossus PCIe card. These are both audio / video capture devices that are capable of 1080i / 720p / AVCHD / H.264 recordings in Media Center (in the default .wtv container). This is done using the analog hole via component video. Therefore such an equipped Media Center system can record 1080i / 720p from cable or satellite set top boxes even from premium channels without having to deal with any of the DRM protection of CableCard. This allows me to archive recordings and never having to worry about extenders or access to said recordings due to encryption issues. Unfortunately there is no native support for the Hauppauge HD PVR or the Colossus PCIe in Media Center so in my case I use DVBLink software for the Hauppauge HD PVR. The Hauppauge Media Center Beta software works but not as well as the DVBLink software IMO.

Anyway, on the system in question, I looked under:

Settings > TV > Guide > About Guide Listings

Which yielded:

Guide End Date 4/21/2016 6:00:00 AM
RCN Manhattan Digital
TV Signal: Digital Satellite (DVB-S) / Digital Satellite (DVB-S)
Rovi

All that seems correct since the DVBLink software reports the Hauppauge HD PVR as a DVB-S tuner and I have two of them installed. The location and provider or also correct. However, if I do the same thing on my other dedicated Media Center system, which has no guide data issues, I see the following:

Guide End Date 4/21/2016 6:00:00 AM
RCN-Queens Queens Digital
TV Signal: Digital Cable (CableCard) / Digital Cable (CableCard) / Digital Cable (CableCard)
Rovi

Which is incorrect, in that the location isn't Queens. I am sure that I entered the correct zip code during the setup so I don't know why its listed as Queens but it works well and has the same lineup.
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Post#17 » Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:26 pm

Wow - that was a very interesting reply!

So with the Dvlink software you don't have to run the Media Center add-in from Hauppauge? This is very interesting because, while the WMC add-in works, it seems to bring the odd bug with it. This has annoyed me for years but I wrote it off as the cost of running WMC with the Colossus.

In my case, I used to run Component to escape the DRM issues but recently changed over to HDMI. This is much, much better as the picture quality is noticeably better (fantastic actually) and it saves me from having all the component cords going into the back of the computer as well as the optical audio line (which often fell out and was somewhat problematic whenever I moved the system). I'm really pleased that I was able to go straight HDMI - way less cord clutter and it makes working on the system really easy - just one cable. Also, with component I was getting the odd 'banding' in the recorded video, a wide line that would slowly move up the screen in the background due to some kind of interference.

I looked into Dvlink years ago but I was pretty sure it could no longer be bought? So I figured it was not possible to get it anymore.
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Post#18 » Sun Apr 17, 2016 3:34 pm

marvin-miller wrote:Wow - that was a very interesting reply!

So with the Dvlink software you don't have to run the Media Center add-in from Hauppauge? This is very interesting because, while the WMC add-in works, it seems to bring the odd bug with it. This has annoyed me for years but I wrote it off as the cost of running WMC with the Colossus.

In my case, I used to run Component to escape the DRM issues but recently changed over to HDMI. This is much, much better as the picture quality is noticeably better (fantastic actually) and it saves me from having all the component cords going into the back of the computer as well as the optical audio line (which often fell out and was somewhat problematic whenever I moved the system). I'm really pleased that I was able to go straight HDMI - way less cord clutter and it makes working on the system really easy - just one cable. Also, with component I was getting the odd 'banding' in the recorded video, a wide line that would slowly move up the screen in the background due to some kind of interference.

I looked into Dvlink years ago but I was pretty sure it could no longer be bought? So I figured it was not possible to get it anymore.


I've been using the DVBLink solution ever since it was available and I bought into it early on. I purchased both DVBLink for Hauppauge HD PVR as well as DVBLink for Hauppauge Colossus because I have a Colossus as well. I don't know if you can still buy the software but the so called demise of Media Center probably doesn't help matters. The installation process is a bit involved but it is manageable I haven't noticed any bugs specific to the software (despite its age) or the Hauppauge HD PVR units but the Hauppauge Beta software for Media Center had the bug where Media Center didn't wait long enough for the Hauppauge units to get the signal (when changing channels for example) so it would toss up an error occasionally. Thats why I prefer the DVBLink software. Plus DVBLink also allows for more then one Hauppauge unit on the same system.

Anyway, to get back to my problem, I went through the process again before my guide data ran out for the local stations (due to the last Microsoft / Rovi guide problem). So I flushed the DNS, objectstorerecovery, shut down, booted. Interestingly enough, the last few times I have done this I didn't have to go through signal setup again. All the channels were there but the guide date took a while to populate / index. I also did not have to setup my scheduled recordings again although I have them auto backed-up now.


Now the guide data seems to be fine again and I can confirm that it is updating on all channels. Currently I have guide data up to April 29th (comparing local and non-local channels to be sure). When I first did the update it went to the 21st or something like that so once again it seems to be updating properly for all channels.

I probably wont mess with it again unless there is a problem (knock on wood). However, I have been entertaining the notion of adding my SiliconDust HDHomeRun Prime to the dual Hauppauge HD PVR units and dual Silicondust HDHomeRun Dual units. I did it once before when troubleshooting this issue and as you would think I was getting 2x for every channel. Now I am thinking I can just renumber the HDHomeRun Prime channels. Merging channels would technically be easier but I would prefer to separate channels. That way I can better predict if a channel / recording will have DRM protection. I won't archive any recording that has DRM because IMO its a disaster waiting to happen. Fortunately a lot of my channels don't have a copy once flag.
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Post#19 » Sun Apr 17, 2016 6:41 pm

When I started with the Colossus I went with Component to side-step the DRM issues. This worked well but my picture quality took a bit of a hit. Recently I bought and HDMI splitter that doesn't pass HDCP - so now I have the best of both worlds. I have much simpler cabling and I got rid of a lot of picture quality interference issues.

Just to confirm, with the DVB link software you don't have to run the Media Center add-in from Hauppauge? If so, I'd like to look into seeing whether I can still get it. For me, this would likely end several of the bugs I tend to see that were introduced with the beta add-in.
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Post#20 » Sun May 22, 2016 5:54 am

Octavean wrote:
I've been using the DVBLink solution ever since it was available and I bought into it early on. I purchased both DVBLink for Hauppauge HD PVR as well as DVBLink for Hauppauge Colossus because I have a Colossus as well. I don't know if you can still buy the software but the so called demise of Media Center probably doesn't help matters. The installation process is a bit involved but it is manageable I haven't noticed any bugs specific to the software (despite its age) or the Hauppauge HD PVR units but the Hauppauge Beta software for Media Center had the bug where Media Center didn't wait long enough for the Hauppauge units to get the signal (when changing channels for example) so it would toss up an error occasionally. Thats why I prefer the DVBLink software. Plus DVBLink also allows for more then one Hauppauge unit on the same system.


I'm looking into it to see if I can still get that software. Question, are you running the 'latest' beta version or the release version?
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