SDV coming to OKC

Help with tuners from ATI, Hauppauge, AverMedia and more.
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RealCodeGuy

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SDV coming to OKC

#1

Post by RealCodeGuy » Thu May 23, 2013 4:13 am

I received a letter from Cox today to inform me starting June 27th I will need a tuning adapter for my Ceton and HDHomerun devices. I have two InfiniTV's in one PC and an HDHomerun on the network. Will I need to request three tuning adapters? SDV is new to me so I hope this transition goes smoothly. Any advice from those who have made the switch would be appreciated.

gcw07

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#2

Post by gcw07 » Thu May 23, 2013 4:17 am

I just got the same letter. I do think you will need 3 to support all the tuners. Don't think you can share any of them. Take a look at the channels though and make sure you care about any of them. I know I didn't as it isn't any HD channel. So if you don't care about the channels on the list, you shouldn't need one.

volfan6415

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#3

Post by volfan6415 » Fri May 24, 2013 2:23 pm

While this is true cox had a habit of moving more channels to SDV. I'm in New Orleans and they went to SDV almost 2 years ago. At first if was only a few Channels but I still get a letter once every 4 or so months about new channels being moved over.

nathagt

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#4

Post by nathagt » Tue May 28, 2013 7:38 pm

I got the letter too. I'm not familiar with SDV. Does this add any features to WMC or is it just so you can watch that channel?

mdavej

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#5

Post by mdavej » Tue May 28, 2013 7:50 pm

You need one tuning adapter per cable card. It adds the feature of being able to tune SDV channels, IOW, just so you can watch that channel.

I have had SDV and tuning adapters since day one and never experienced any problems. However some have a few quirks. Since you need a coax feed to the adapter and another coax feed to your tuner, there are different ways to make those connections. Many tuning adapters have a pass thru, so you can connect one coax to the input port of the adapter and another out of the adapter to your tuner. But sometimes this doesn't work very well, weakening the signal too much. So it is better to split the incoming coax before the adapter and attach one leg to the adapter and the other to your tuner. Ceton generally recommends this method.

Since SDV frees up a lot of bandwidth, you should see improved picture quality across the board. And your cable company now has space for a lot more HD channels, so hopefully some additions are in your future.

richard1980

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#6

Post by richard1980 » Tue May 28, 2013 11:57 pm

SDV (Switched Digital Video) is a technology that allows the cable company to switch digital streams on and off in response to viewer demand. If there's no demand for a specific stream, that stream is switched off until demand exists. When the demand exists (i.e., a viewer tries to tune that stream), the stream is switched on.

SDV does not free up any bandwidth (well, in a properly designed system it won't). While it is true that the total bandwidth used when at least one stream is switched off will be lower than when all streams are switched on, switching off a stream does not allow that stream's bandwidth to be reallocated. The bandwidth must still be held in reserve in order to honor a "switch on" request. If the bandwidth is not held in reserve, there may not be sufficient bandwidth available to satisfy the "switch on" request. Of course, a poorly designed system may not take this into account, and would eventually result in the same bandwidth issues that have plagued IP networks for decades.

The real benefit to SDV is it allows the cable companies to monitor channel viewership statistics, which is an excellent bit of information to have when it comes time to renew a content agreement. Obviously they don't want to pay a lot of money for a channel that is hardly ever watched, and high-demand channels translate to lost subscribers when an agreement isn't reached. Additionally, SDV statistics could help the cable company offer packages that are more tailored to viewer demands.

nathagt

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#7

Post by nathagt » Wed May 29, 2013 1:51 pm

Thanks for the explanation!

erkotz

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#8

Post by erkotz » Wed May 29, 2013 10:28 pm

richard1980 wrote:SDV (Switched Digital Video) is a technology that allows the cable company to switch digital streams on and off in response to viewer demand. If there's no demand for a specific stream, that stream is switched off until demand exists. When the demand exists (i.e., a viewer tries to tune that stream), the stream is switched on.

SDV does not free up any bandwidth (well, in a properly designed system it won't). While it is true that the total bandwidth used when at least one stream is switched off will be lower than when all streams are switched on, switching off a stream does not allow that stream's bandwidth to be reallocated. The bandwidth must still be held in reserve in order to honor a "switch on" request. If the bandwidth is not held in reserve, there may not be sufficient bandwidth available to satisfy the "switch on" request. Of course, a poorly designed system may not take this into account, and would eventually result in the same bandwidth issues that have plagued IP networks for decades.

The real benefit to SDV is it allows the cable companies to monitor channel viewership statistics, which is an excellent bit of information to have when it comes time to renew a content agreement. Obviously they don't want to pay a lot of money for a channel that is hardly ever watched, and high-demand channels translate to lost subscribers when an agreement isn't reached. Additionally, SDV statistics could help the cable company offer packages that are more tailored to viewer demands.
This is not correct. SDV does free up bandwidth because the majority of people on a node will be watching a few popular channels, and less popular channels can be switched off. Most SDV deployments also share QAMs between SDV and OnDemand content, giving them a single larger pool to play with.

Bandwidth for SDV is not guaranteed and it is possible that a node can be saturated, denying the request to switch the channel on. I have not heard of this happening, but it is possible
Quality Assurance Manager, Ceton Corporation

richard1980

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#9

Post by richard1980 » Thu May 30, 2013 2:06 am

erkotz wrote:SDV does free up bandwidth because the majority of people on a node will be watching a few popular channels, and less popular channels can be switched off.
Not having data actively being transmitted is not the same as free. Free means the bandwidth can be used for a different purpose.
erkotz wrote:Bandwidth for SDV is not guaranteed and it is possible that a node can be saturated, denying the request to switch the channel on.
Yeah, that's an FCC fine waiting to happen, not to mention a class-action lawsuit waiting to happen. Oh, and let's not forget about a content owner that is fighting for ratings and expects his content to be delivered to the viewers...or the people that are employed in making that content.

There's a big difference between what is possible in theory and what actually happens in practice.

erkotz

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#10

Post by erkotz » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:49 pm

richard1980 wrote:
erkotz wrote:SDV does free up bandwidth because the majority of people on a node will be watching a few popular channels, and less popular channels can be switched off.
Not having data actively being transmitted is not the same as free. Free means the bandwidth can be used for a different purpose.
erkotz wrote:Bandwidth for SDV is not guaranteed and it is possible that a node can be saturated, denying the request to switch the channel on.
Yeah, that's an FCC fine waiting to happen, not to mention a class-action lawsuit waiting to happen. Oh, and let's not forget about a content owner that is fighting for ratings and expects his content to be delivered to the viewers...or the people that are employed in making that content.

There's a big difference between what is possible in theory and what actually happens in practice.
An SDV tune being denied is really no different than an OnDemand request being denied. There isn't enough bandwidth on a given node for every box to watch OnDemand at once. I know providers also allocate quite a bit of bandwidth to this. I'm "camping" on about 6 QAM's worth of HD channels in my house and the SDV guy at TWC didn't even blink when I mentioned it to him.
Quality Assurance Manager, Ceton Corporation

richard1980

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#11

Post by richard1980 » Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:22 am

The request to purchase on-demand content can be denied before the user is charged anything, so there is no harm in denying the on-demand request. The same does not apply to subscription SDV channels, where the user is paying a monthly fee to access the channel and has a reasonable expectation that they will be able to access that channel at all times during the subscription period. Obviously service interruptions happen, but there are rules in place to ensure that those interruptions are dealt with promptly:
47 CFR 76.309(C)(2)(ii) wrote:Excluding conditions beyond the control of the operator, the cable operator will begin working on “service interruptions” promptly and in no event later than 24 hours after the interruption becomes known. The cable operator must begin actions to correct other service problems the next business day after notification of the service problem.
47 CFR 76.309(C)(4)(iii) wrote:Service interruption— The term “service interruption” means the loss of picture or sound on one or more cable channels.
I really don't see why you would argue your position. The idea that a cable company can charge a customer for something and then not deliver it is absolutely ridiculous.

richard1980

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#12

Post by richard1980 » Wed Mar 12, 2014 3:53 am

Well apparently they recently switched the SD Encore channels to SDV (sometime since the end of January). I wasn't concerned with the SDV switch until a couple of days ago when I realized that some of the channels I actually watch are now switched. So earlier today I went by a local Cox store to pick up a couple of TAs for my HDHRPs. The guy brought out the two TAs, and after I saw how large they were (about 12" x 8" x 2"), I told him to keep the TAs and cancel my subscription to Encore. I'm already opposed to the concept of SDV for the reasons listed earlier in this thread, and now even more so after seeing the size of the TAs they want me to use.

I have a feeling that as time goes on, more and more channels will become switched, and soon I'll just cancel my entire cable subscription.

barnabas1969

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#13

Post by barnabas1969 » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:44 pm

Richard, that's one of the main reasons I was so happy that the TA connects directly to the HD HomeRun PRIME. I hid both HDHRP's and both TA's in the closet. Those TA's are as big as a normal cable box. I read somewhere that the SA/Cisco TA's are just repurposed old standard def cable boxes. I don't know if that's true or not. I've had SDV since day one, and mine works great.

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